• Please use real names.

    Greetings to all who have registered to OPF and those guests taking a look around. Please use real names. Registrations with fictitious names will not be processed. REAL NAMES ONLY will be processed

    Firstname Lastname

    Register

    We are a courteous and supportive community. No need to hide behind an alia. If you have a genuine need for privacy/secrecy then let me know!
  • Welcome to the new site. Here's a thread about the update where you can post your feedback, ask questions or spot those nasty bugs!

Can you help us in a SWOT analysis of OPF?

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
We are reviewing OPF's organization and mission. We want to maintain the concepts and openness that lead to Nicolas Claris, myself and others forming OPF, but update what's needed to exploit fully our potential in the current internet ecosystem.

Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities, and Threats are what make up such an examination.

We must apply SWOT analysis the website to have achievable goals and exploit our strengths while
correcting or minimizing our weaknesses or converting these and threats to opportunities.


  • Strengths: characteristics of the business or project that give it an advantage over others.

    [*]Weaknesses:characteristics that place the business or project at a disadvantage relative to others

  • Opportunities: elements that the project could exploit to its advantage

  • Threats: elements in the environment that could cause trouble for the business or project


1. Can you provide at least what you seek to find here that's especially valuable to you? Do we do any part of this especially well?

2. What are our weaknesses that prevent us from thriving as much as we'd like?

3. What are the paths we could take to exploit capabilities and openings that we do not address?

4. What are the forces which draw folk away from us. How can we remedy this?

As part of this, if you have links to previously posted analysis or correspondence and you can locate them or summarize the ideas, that would be helpful. Send them to me by PM.

Thanks for your help.

Feel free to be as critical as you wish, but if it's negative about someone here, send it to me privately so as to respect everyone as much as possible.

Asher
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
We are reviewing OPF's organization and mission. We want to maintain the concepts and openness that lead to Nicolas Claris, myself and others forming OPF, but update what's needed to exploit fully our potential in the current internet ecosystem.

Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities, and Threats are what make up such an examination.

1. Can you provide at least what you seek to find here that's especially valuable to you? Do we do any part of this especially well?

2. What are our weaknesses that prevent us from thriving as much as we'd like?

3. What are the paths we could take to exploit capabilities and openings that we do not address?

4. What are the forces which draw folk away from us. How can we remedy this?

As part of this, if you have links to previously posted analysis or correspondence and you can locate them or summarize the ideas, that would be helpful. Send them to me by PM.

Thanks for your help.

Feel free to be as critical as you wish, but if it's negative about someone here, send it to me privately so as to respect everyone as much as possible.

Asher

#4 Maybe facebook try something similar. Just my 2 cents !
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
James,

Could you expand on that, perhaps. What of Facebook is out threat or should be copied?

Asher

Hello Asher

I think lots of people leave forums and go to facebook. I am only suggesting a similar type of format for members but obviously on a much smaller scale.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Hello Asher

I think lots of people leave forums and go to facebook. I am only suggesting a similar type of format for members but obviously on a much smaller scale.


Thanks James for this detail. Can you articulate what aspects of Facebook are so attractive? Is it the ease in posting, the friends lists and notifications when someone in your circle of friends or interest posts?

Asher
 

Antonio Correia

Well-known member
I think these are all difficult questions to answer.
I have been in three or four forums in the last perhaps ten years, and I have seen different approaches about Photography. Too many are just technical...

For example, dgrin is a vast and large see of threads where you can quickly be lost and... not found. Unless... you post everyday. Well, it used to be anyway.
Here we (you) have pursuit a different direction, quite interesting and more "artistic" if I may say so.
I do not come to forums as much as I used to and this is the one I most visit theses days.

The quality of a forum is not measured by numbers of its members but by their quality. Here there are quite some people with quality, artistic and technical.

One little thing I would like to see implemented is the avatar which allows us to identify the person very quickly.

How about consulting a web analyst ?

This is my poor contribution. :)
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
Thanks James for this detail. Can you articulate what aspects of Facebook are so attractive? Is it the ease in posting, the friends lists and notifications when someone in your circle of friends or interest posts?

Asher

Hello Asher

Things such as like buttons although a bit passive but I think useful and "yes"... ease of posting plus others you have listed. I use my real name but maybe if one had a choice it might be better for some and you could still apply the same rules. The main benefit that I see is that each individual has their own page with a compilation of the photographer's images in one place. You can also scroll through the photographer's work in a very nice sideshow. I thinks this type of format gives the viewer a better understanding of the photographer's work and is beneficial to both as apposed to having ones work spread out over some type of web page waste land. I don't know if this would serve your purpose or is possible ,they are just my thoughts on the matter.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Hello Asher

Things such as like buttons although a bit passive but I think useful and "yes"... ease of posting plus others you have listed. I use my real name but maybe if one had a choice it might be better for some and you could still apply the same rules. The main benefit that I see is that each individual has their own page with a compilation of the photographer's images in one place. You can also scroll through the photographer's work in a very nice sideshow. I thinks this type of format gives the viewer a better understanding of the photographer's work and is beneficial to both as apposed to having ones work spread out over some type of web page waste land. I don't know if this would serve your purpose or is possible, they are just my thoughts on the matter.

James,

Thanks for the clarifications. I imagine in the SWOT analysis this would come into "Opportunities" as these changes allow the website to be more "socially-dynamic" by ease of access and allowing each photographer to point to and not miss "the type of work they love most".

Individual Pages with gallery: I like the idea of each person having their own web page. I floated that idea with a new design allowing one to pick photographers by their main fields of interest or name and see their individual page and images. The idea didn't get support, instead, "I have my Flickr or what ever account". But yes, I think this would be a good idea. Folk could have that populated with just a few or all the pictures they wanted.

Each would be searchable and accessible from within any thread where the person posts.

Avatar: I like the idea but others don't as they think it's too loud and untidy for the page. however, we could use a small photograph. I'll look at other fora I like to see what they do.

Ease of Joining:currently 80% or so of registrations are disallowed because of being identified as known spammers. This does take time but protects us. If we allow joining via Facebook, then these folk would be monitored differently and weeded out rapidly. Chances are that we'd be O.K.

Real Name: This is harder to deal with and keep the straightforward and honest characteristic of "being" a real person here and not "undercover". Perhaps if the person arrives via a Facebook account, with some record of substance, then they could enter as a guest-member with posting-access to say just "Introduction" and "Layback Café". To be a "Full" member they'd have to be here a certain amount of time, be active, give their real name and then be allowed to use their alias. This is an area where we'd need buy-in, advice and agreement from existing OPFrs.

Buttons: These help in improving the social connectivity of the forum with "Like" and "Follow" and "Gallery" and "Friend" choices. It allows one to put before each individual the kind of work they are interested in, no matter where in OPF these are placed.

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
I think these are all difficult questions to answer.
I have been in three or four forums in the last perhaps ten years, and I have seen different approaches about Photography. Too many are just technical...

For example, dgrin is a vast and large see of threads where you can quickly be lost and... not found. Unless... you post everyday. Well, it used to be anyway.
Here we (you) have pursuit a different direction, quite interesting and more "artistic" if I may say so.
I do not come to forums as much as I used to and this is the one I most visit theses days.

Antonio,

Thanks for this helpful feedback!

Identity being lost in a "large sea of threads: as a "W" or "Weakness" in the SWOT approach, as even in OPF, for those who don't post often enough between travel and job assignments where they have neither time nor access.

Strengths: The quality of a forum is not measured by numbers of its members but by their quality. Here there are quite some people with quality, artistic and technical. Yes, that's one of our strengths and the other is that we are more very interested in the esthetic value of picture much more than owning the tools. Yes we can get into it when someone needs to choose a new system for a particular goal, but that is

One little thing I would like to see implemented is the avatar which allows us to identify the person very quickly.

See the response to James Lemon, above :)

How about consulting a web analyst ?

Analytics: Am doing that, just need to find the type of analytics that would work for us. SNAPP is an example of what interests me for social interactions. I'd like to know if it can be used on a vBulletin forum???

This is my poor contribution. :)

You've been especially helpful!

Asher
 

Michael Nagel

Well-known member
A few observations

Asher,

No analysis, but a few thoughts and observations.

This is a relatively small forum when counting the active members - for me this means people posting within a three month timeframe.
This means that people posting regularily have a pretty high chance to respond to a forum post of anybody of the regular crowd.

Now - each one is an individual and individualist here. View may and will differ and there is a minimum of respect needed towards everybody else and the work presented.
There were cases where this respect was not there, but this is the exception and in the cases I have seen it, these were (what I would call it) hit and run posters.

There is a lot of good work presented here - how would it make this forum more attractive?
The front page would need a rehaul - other forums make use of Pictures and gallerys hosted by the forum, picture of the day/week/month, choose your favorite time frame. Featured artist/member gallery and so on.
I do not suggest that this should be done, this is just to show other approaches.

I would like to see discussions about visual concepts and their implications rather than technical discussions, regardless how valuable these may be to other members.
It is just that there were more discussions on 'What is Art' and technical tidbits than anything else except for presenting pictures.

What drives us to take pictures (apart from selling them for the professional members) and what is the (artistic) intent?

I could imagine projects where some members work together, but I would use another frame than a challenge.
Sorry, but if you want art or something alike, don't make it a competition, most artists have that already on the art market and professional photographers as well.

This is - of course - my personal and biased opinion.

Best regards,
Michael
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Michael,

Thanks for your input. I appreciate the time you've taken to give this valuable feedback and I will try to respond to each issue you raise. Since it's easier to use some of your text as topic headings, I'll write in a different typeface.


Asher,

No analysis, but a few thoughts and observations.

Your input helps me become capable in making an analysis by corroborating my ideas and those of others as well as alerting me to issues I've overlooked.

This is a relatively small forum when counting the active members - for me this means people posting within a three month timeframe.
This means that people posting regularily have a pretty high chance to respond to a forum post of anybody of the regular crowd.[/quote]

We could do better perhaps. Right now, folk still don't see all the buried work with which they have a keen interest, since we don't track "likes" and have "follow" buttons as options.

Now - each one is an individual and individualist here. View may and will differ and there is a minimum of respect needed towards everybody else and the work presented.

There were cases where this respect was not there, but this is the exception and in the cases I have seen it, these were (what I would call it) hit and run posters.

I try to look at stated reasons.

(It could be folk don't like my own style of steering the OPF boat or sometimes professorial style that might be mistaken for behaving as some kind of "Guru", I hope not, LOL - PM feedback would be welcomed!)

One left because of religious reasons, another felt his work was disrespected, another because of the technical articles and drop in conversations about the artistic values in pictures. We can only correct the respect issue by example or rapid intervention, the averse response to technical matters by sequestration of posts related to images, art appreciation and esthetics from technical matters and gear.

There is a lot of good work presented here - how would it make this forum more attractive?

"The front page would need a rehaul - For sure, we'll do it ASAP.

Pictures and gallerys hosted by the forum, Will be implemented ASAP

picture of the day/week/month, choose your favorite time frame. Featured artist/member gallery and so on. I do not suggest that this should be done, this is just to show other approaches." Something like this for sure is worth consideration.

I would like to see discussions about visual concepts and their implications rather than technical discussions, regardless how valuable these may be to other members.
It is just that there were more discussions on 'What is Art' and technical tidbits than anything else except for presenting pictures.

I agree, as this is where our strength and uniqueness needs to be exploited and advanced further.

What drives us to take pictures (apart from selling them for the professional members) and what is the (artistic) intent?

This goes well with fleshing out the OPF character and distinguishing it from other websites.

The Challenges: I could imagine projects where some members work together, but I would use another frame than a challenge. Sorry, but if you want art or something alike, don't make it a competition, most artists have that already on the art market and professional photographers as well.

You're correct. "Challenge" is the wrong word and is misleading and I now see that it can indeed carry an unintended concept of competition. We need to change that to something like "Thematic Collection" or something that's more concise. The "Challenge" threads in "Themes" has successfully brought together good work by photographers with otherwise divergent interests.

This is - of course - my personal and biased opinion.

…...and that's what makes it so genuine and valuable for us!

Thanks,

Asher
 

Andy brown

Well-known member
Hi Asher,

I think OPF's greatest strength is you.
Your tireless dedication and your superbly diplomatic approach is amazing and definitely keeps it alive, upbeat and positive.

The quality of posters and their skills and beautiful images are a real strength.

I get the impression that young new visitors might find us a bit staid, you know all correct punctuation and considered responses, it might feel like a bit of an old boys club.
I'm not sure if this a weakness or a strength. It would entirely depend on your perspective.
Andy
 
agreement

Hi Asher,

I think OPF's greatest strength is you.
Your tireless dedication and your superbly diplomatic approach is amazing and definitely keeps it alive, upbeat and positive.

The quality of posters and their skills and beautiful images are a real strength.

I get the impression that young new visitors might find us a bit staid, you know all correct punctuation and considered responses, it might feel like a bit of an old boys club.
I'm not sure if this a weakness or a strength. It would entirely depend on your perspective.
Andy

I think that you're right Andy,not sure about the old boys club, hadn't ever thought about that.

Bill
 

Antonio Correia

Well-known member
I am sorry I was not able to remember how important Asher in this whole process.

I absolutely agree with Andy Brown. ! Thank you for saying that Andy :)
 

Chris Heilman

New member
We are reviewing OPF's organization and mission. We want to maintain the concepts and openness that lead to Nicolas Claris, myself and others forming OPF, but update what's needed to exploit fully our potential in the current internet ecosystem.

Strengths, Weaknesses, Opportunities, and Threats are what make up such an examination.

We must apply SWOT analysis the website to have achievable goals and exploit our strengths while
correcting or minimizing our weaknesses or converting these and threats to opportunities.


  • Strengths: characteristics of the business or project that give it an advantage over others.

    [*]Weaknesses:characteristics that place the business or project at a disadvantage relative to others

  • Opportunities: elements that the project could exploit to its advantage

  • Threats: elements in the environment that could cause trouble for the business or project


1. Can you provide at least what you seek to find here that's especially valuable to you? Do we do any part of this especially well?

2. What are our weaknesses that prevent us from thriving as much as we'd like?

3. What are the paths we could take to exploit capabilities and openings that we do not address?

4. What are the forces which draw folk away from us. How can we remedy this?

As part of this, if you have links to previously posted analysis or correspondence and you can locate them or summarize the ideas, that would be helpful. Send them to me by PM.

Thanks for your help.

Feel free to be as critical as you wish, but if it's negative about someone here, send it to me privately so as to respect everyone as much as possible.

Asher

Strengths: OPF's focus onthe image, imaging and especially bodies of photographic work. The level of insight of members into the concepts and ideas behind pictures is great here. I remember a picture of a bridge a few months ago that was so well analysed and discussed - pure intellectual pleasure. And series/sequences - for me, this is the direction that contemporary photography must go in order to survive the future. Most memorable was the website that had women reading something intellectual while experiencing an induced orgasm ... priceless, and not possible without an uninhibited concept of what constitutes photography. Other sites would not have highlighted such a project, even though it is at the forefront of what makes photography unique.

Weaknesses: Cliquishness and pomposity. Of course it makes sense, the oldies that have been here for years are a constant, and are loyal. I get that. But often I come across a thread by a noob that is totally panned or (worse) mostly ignored. Asher, you do a good job of commenting on every thread by new members, but I cannot say the same for many of the 'old guard' here. I am often reminded of a gathering of old men who just don't want their chains rattled. The solution to this? Well, if I could state that in a few lines, I'd have the most popular photography related website on the 'net. But, accepting new ideas, concepts and styles is the way forward, right? (disclaimer: I am a noob here.)

Opportunities: Those are endless, right? Often I am so overwhelmed by the possibilities that I become paralyzed, unable to realize even the simplest of my ideas. In my experience, un-scored group activities have always increased participation. Especially when the rules allow only positive comments. Of course there is underlying criticism, but for dealing with (essentially) strangers on the internet, kudos feel better than disses. At Nikon Cafe (a web community I administered for years, a position from which I am recently retired) we have a number of popular activities: collective shoots, memes, year-long series, and challenges. Of these only the challenges have "winners", the rest have only "internet glory" as a prize, and the prizes are self administered. Yet they create community - the participants tend to group together, Countermanding my earlier comment about cliques, such groups are always looking to expand. Newbies are encouraged, cherished and ... learned from!

Threats: Really, threats? In an online photography community? Not very likely, but perceptions are perceptions, and there is not much one can do about them. I saw a reference to the requirement that one use one's real name. This can surely be perceived as a threat. Your name is a route to your soul, etc, but more in the real world, one's name can lead to litigation and retaliation. Perhaps the use of one's real first name would suffice for the purpose here? This IS the internet afterall. The goals of threat reduction is easing of requirements that make folks uncomfortable. Ask them what makes you uncomfortable here, and you will then hear about it.

Thanks for the opportunity to give you this feedback Asher. As I am not very invested in this community, yet value it's unique perspective, I find this worthwhile to support in this way. I want OPF to succeed - it's different and for me, useful.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Chris,

You're extraordinarily helpful in your frankness and it allows me to better imagine other areas of value, concern and opportunities to improve. Be assured that I will be reading and rereading everyone's comments and do my utmost to maintain what we value as we attempt to go to new heights.

The issue of names is a touchy subject with a lot of folk. I've always supported the idea that a real name establishes a standard of behavior that ranks above crass nastiness and disrespect we see in some other fora. But is it real names we are after of just good manners? I wonder whether just having a Facebook or Linked In identity already filters out non-sincere or mischievous players. I've never thought of using the first name. Perhaps first name and initial if they provide full name just for registration?

More opinions are needed on the subject of real names - what we get and what we lose in the process!

Asher
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
Hello Asher

One should be able to view an image in it's entirety without having to resort to scrolling up and down to see an image. It's very distracting to say the least and not the way I like to experience viewing images.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Hello Asher

One should be able to view an image in it's entirety without having to resort to scrolling up and down to see an image. It's very distracting to say the least and not the way I like to experience viewing images.

Thanks James,

Thanks for this feedback. Yes it's annoying to have to scroll. In the worse cases, I have asked the poster to add an additional more compact version!

Am I one of the the guilty parties, ? :( !!!!

What's your needs and recommendations as far as image size is concerned? Would it be a good idea to have an ability to alter the size of the image by shrinking or expanding or a set of fixed sizes so that folk with large screens and small screens could all be served well?

Do you know any website uses a system we should look at to emulate?

Asher
 

Chris Heilman

New member
Chris,

You're extraordinarily helpful in your frankness and it allows me to better imagine other areas of value, concern and opportunities to improve. Be assured that I will be reading and rereading everyone's comments and do my utmost to maintain what we value as we attempt to go to new heights.

The issue of names is a touchy subject with a lot of folk. I've always supported the idea that a real name establishes a standard of behavior that ranks above crass nastiness and disrespect we see in some other fora. But is it real names we are after of just good manners? I wonder whether just having a Facebook or Linked In identity already filters out non-sincere or mischievous players. I've never thought of using the first name. Perhaps first name and initial if they provide full name just for registration?

More opinions are needed on the subject of real names - what we get and what we lose in the process!

Asher

I would vote in favor of first names - I am known on nearly every other forum I visit as Chris101. That name means "me" just as much as "Heilman" does, on the internet anyway.
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
Thanks James,

Thanks for this feedback. Yes it's annoying to have to scroll. In the worse cases, I have asked the poster to add an additional more compact version!

Am I one of the the guilty parties, ? :( !!!!

What's your needs and recommendations as far as image size is concerned? Would it be a good idea to have an ability to alter the size of the image by shrinking or expanding or a set of fixed sizes so that folk with large screens and small screens could all be served well?

Do you know any website uses a system we should look at to emulate?

Asher

Asher

Regarding image size ...800 wide by 600 high are considered to be about right for most forum posts. All of my posts are this size for example. What purpose is there in posting anything larger? The other benefit is they are not worth stealing.
 

Doug Kerr

Well-known member
Hi, James,

Regarding image size ...800 wide by 600 high are considered to be about right for most forum posts. All of my posts are this size for example. What purpose is there in posting anything larger? The other benefit is they are not worth stealing.

I generally use limits of 800 px of width and 600 px of height (both limits must be satisfied) for my images on the forum.

There are of course special cases where I do not apply those limits.

In do not in general provide mats with my images.

Best regards,

Doug
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
I would vote in favor of first names - I am known on nearly every other forum I visit as Chris101. That name means "me" just as much as "Heilman" does, on the internet anyway.


Well, for you, Chris, it would be valid, because Chris101 is almost like your "trademark". You can demonstrate that you are a photographer of standing with a reputation to maintain. The avalanche of trouble comes when folk register with "curvy", leggy, fatboyX and the like or "Running Water"! I had a guy who was European but decided he was now a native American and was so insulted when I asked for his original real name only so we could check him out, as usual for spamming or other nefarious activity.

One solution, is to perhaps, if there is overwhelming support, reward photographers with longstanding professional reputations, (e.g. they exhibit or sell photography or do commissions under such a special name. We could consider equally use such a name on extensively other photography websites. (or here, by allowing a web name here too for "Senior Members". So it would be something "earned"! I pressured and persuaded a reluctant Cem_Usakligil to use his real name and eventually won him over. we could have prevented him ever sharing his wonderful photography. So so wouldn't it be hypocritical and wrong for us to simply open a floodgate of hidden identities to newbies here?

Essentially, for me, I'm very open to change, but we'd need the buy in by enough folk who contribute regularly.

Asher
 

Chris Heilman

New member
Heh. I guess the Euro/First Nationer moved from Alamogordo to Bruges, otherwise I don't quite see how that would happen! :()

Thanks for the flattery, but I run into "the name Chris101 has already been used" a lot! So I have a second and third choice that I also use (I'm Chris 102 on DPR.) Last year I met the single named photographer, Pobi. Although I had never heard of him, I guess he's a bit famous, and so I guess could register here without a surname. There are a few others as well, who have but one name.

On the other hand, there are some folks who have been stalking victims, etc., who do not use their real name on the internet. A pushed-to-the-limit example would be someone in the witness protection program. In order to cover those cases (without asking any questions), using a REAL first name, but no last name would provide some anonymity as well as giving a bit of responsibility to the named to be at least partially revealing. Screen names would, of course, continue to be outlawed. Obviously I have no problem with using my real first & last names. That is already the norm here, and would likely continue for active participants. But removing the requirement for a verifiable last name would lower the accessibility barrier.

When researching members, doesn't the email address and connection IP yield more information about a poster anyway? Especially if their real name is Steve Smith or something like that.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
When researching members, doesn't the email address and connection IP yield more information about a poster anyway? Especially if their real name is Steve Smith or something like that.

Chris,

It's really helpful for me to have others also try to get their minds around this without simply rejecting it out of hand or suggesting it doesn't matter anyway.

We do check the IP address and that's so useful. However, some reputable folk have IP addresses that come out as highly suspicious. I've found that with some registrations from South Africa which seem to be shared over a wide area.!I am not an expert on allocation of IP addresses, but there's something really unreliable in the level of evidence IP address lookup gives.

I must admit that most often, if the person is from India, The Philippines, China, Russia or Nigeria, I've used up all the trust I could gather and simply believe bad reports. For other locations I take the effort to search for an actual pro website, web presence in a reputable forum or else personal gallery that's from a human being with some feelings. I look hard for reasons to put aside the negative reports and write to them. Unfortunately, the yield, even then, is about one reply in 10 attempts to get them to confirm some human identity. I've no gotten to recognize the names of repeat spammers!

I'd love to be able to simple open the doors here, but I once awoke to see a full page obscene picture that made me sick and so sorry for the discomfort it would give so many viewers. So it's an ongoing challenge. The best approach would be personal recommendation. So if anyone referred a new photographer and vouched for them and they wanted to give just a first name, that would be fine.

I think we have to allow this to simmer and someone might be able to articulate a good policy that protects us but also lowers the barrier and makes us more open to new photographers who are more private, but as honest as the rest of us.

Asher
 
Top