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Two couples and a bench

Hi,

Some trial with a Sigma DP2s... I love this camera but i still don't succeed to get shots as i would like they are... Something doesn't work.

4a8b6963112f17bcc82d91a20154aeb.jpg
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Cedric,

This camera should excel in interpretation of color. The picture does seem flat. I wonder if you simply need to look at the gamma they use in treating the RAW file? Perhaps you might add an S-Curve.

Asher
 

Paul Abbott

New member
This is an interesting picture. I like how the scene has been divided up by the shadows and other elements.
I think it would be interesting and rewarding maybe, to re-visit this place at the same time and look for more compositions with people. I say this 'cos i'm a fan of Alex Webb's photographs and he creates some fantastic compositions of people in cities.

If you get the time you can check his work out over on the Magnum site, here:

http://www.magnumphotos.com/Archive/C.aspx?VP=XSpecific_MAG.StaticPage_VPage&SP=photographers_list&l1=0&XXAPXX=SubPanel10
 
Another attempt, in color and from RAW file, but i am still not satisfied...

091d1888eeae5732f425efafd0c7dff.jpg


Finally, i think i prefer basic in-camera jpeg, even if highlights are burnt :


6f014dd81152f59006c7a20837011aa.jpg
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Hi,

Some trial with a Sigma DP2s... I love this camera but i still don't succeed to get shots as i would like they are... Something doesn't work.

4a8b6963112f17bcc82d91a20154aeb.jpg


Cedrc Massoulier: Two Couples and a Bench

Original

Well Cedric,

I had to try at least. However, I am not sharing your mind and vision so I can only make guesses as to what you might want from the scene and the camera. These are two separate parameters.

Quand même il faut essayer!


091d1888eeaetwo couples one bench.jpg


Cedrc Massoulier: Two Couples and a Bench

Edited ADK



Here I've taken the grand liberty of removing the distracting telephone system with the interfering poles and cables, as, for sure they have cell phones! Now the bench has negative space around it and with selective sharpening of what's important I think you might possibly find it more agreeable. This is what you might have felt. When we are moved by something beautiful, we often erase the reality of faults in what we experience. I think that this might have happened when you looked at this scene. The telephone wires and poles might not have existed for you for the moment.

Asher
 
Hi Asher,

Hum, in fact i used those wires to get a frame in the frame, it was an important element of the picture ;)

I think this picture is better in color but i discovered yesterday evening that i have serious problems with Sigma Photo Pro software (SPP) : there are mysterious color shifts and casts when i edit X3F files (raw files from Sigma), i can't get a correct tonality... Colors are really weird and un-natural... When i convert X3F files to DNG files using Adobe DNG Converter, i can edit them in Camera Raw and i get neutral and balanced colors as they should be in SPP... But, then, sharpness seems to be far from what i could obtain in SPP... So, i have now a serious post-treatment problem to solve before to continue with my pictures, it's quite frustrating and hard to understand.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Hi Asher,

Hum, in fact i used those wires to get a frame in the frame, it was an important element of the picture ;)


Cedric,

Yes, you imagined that! Well that was not a possibility that I had considered! Well, I did not succeed this time! It's always a risk trying to "better" express what another person is trying to articulate! Eventually, good friends and strong enemies can finish each other's sentences! I'd hope to be in the former category.

Still, it's possible that when you see the scene, you see it without the wires and then with it too. In real life, all you have to do is move your head and the wires do not take anything away from the sky. Nothing is blocked. Also you can smell the salt of the sea water. So the wires may not be so distracting when you are experiencing so much. On a flat screen, however, everything is fixed and we see only what's there, before us. You can remember!

Now, Cedric, this is even before the Sigma chain of translating your ideas into colors get screwed up!

I think this picture is better in color but i discovered yesterday evening that i have serious problems with Sigma Photo Pro software (SPP) : there are mysterious color shifts and casts when i edit X3F files (raw files from Sigma), i can't get a correct tonality... Colors are really weird and un-natural... When i convert X3F files to DNG files using Adobe DNG Converter, i can edit them in Camera Raw and i get neutral and balanced colors as they should be in SPP... But, then, sharpness seems to be far from what i could obtain in SPP... So, i have now a serious post-treatment problem to solve before to continue with my pictures, it's quite frustrating and hard to understand.

I'm sorry you are having this problem with color. How about the B&W. Is that not what you'd hope for too?

Asher
 
Hi Asher,

I realise that i didn't even comment your proposal and it is not very fair : your composition works very well, it's simplier and clearer than my original one. In fact, you have very well developped the original idea which was the relationship between two "couples" (two women and two men) in this urban space. You enhanced B&W rendition and clarity, so your image has a special vibration : really, we can concentrate on these four peoples who could give several potential relational combinations on this empty bench. We can easily imagine those people sit down together on the bench ! In fact, Asher, you succeed to finish and improve my beginning work (as a good friend of course !) while i was taking another direction with color trials...

What is interesting is that we have here two very pertinent proposals where each one owns its proper rendition and feeling, with very different meanings :

1. your B&W version is more emotional and talks about people and relationships, there's a clear connection between the two couples and the bench :



091d1888eeaetwo%20couples%20one%20bench.jpg

2. while my color version is more about urban geometry and loneliness, here people don't really matter, the most important pattern is the repetition of horizontal and vertical lines which separate characters, associated to a violent light which provokes some confusion :

6f014dd81152f59006c7a20837011aa.jpg
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Hi Asher,

I realise that i didn't even comment your proposal and it is not very fair : your composition works very well, it's simplier and clearer than my original one. In fact, you have very well developped the original idea which was the relationship between two "couples" (two women and two men) in this urban space. You enhanced B&W rendition and clarity, so your image has a special vibration : really, we can concentrate on these four peoples who could give several potential relational combinations on this empty bench. We can easily imagine those people sit down together on the bench ! In fact, Asher, you succeed to finish and improve my beginning work (as a good friend of course !) while i was taking another direction with color trials...

What is interesting is that we have here two very pertinent proposals where each one owns its proper rendition and feeling, with very different meanings :

1. your B&W version is more emotional and talks about people and relationships, there's a clear connection between the two couples and the bench :



091d1888eeaetwo%20couples%20one%20bench.jpg

2. while my color version is more about urban geometry and loneliness, here people don't really matter, the most important pattern is the repetition of horizontal and vertical lines which separate characters, associated to a violent light which provokes some confusion :

6f014dd81152f59006c7a20837011aa.jpg


You are most kind! I now can see clearly your own vision. not having explained in advance really helped challenge me as to your motives, intent, difficulties and therefore needs. As a consequence, I was on my own and succeeded in finding a special relationship.

I learned a lot from this. By knowing nothing and faced with an image, we construct a story based, sometimes more on our own personal priorities and esthetics, not the author's needs. The tough exercise is fruitful, enfin, but challenging!

Thanks for providing that challenge. It's in a way, he foil against which we can test our new ways of thinking.

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
An Elegant Challenge!

Hi Asher,

I realise that i didn't even comment your proposal and it is not very fair : your composition works very well, it's simplier and clearer than my original one. In fact, you have very well developped the original idea which was the relationship between two "couples" (two women and two men) in this urban space. You enhanced B&W rendition and clarity, so your image has a special vibration : really, we can concentrate on these four peoples who could give several potential relational combinations on this empty bench. We can easily imagine those people sit down together on the bench ! In fact, Asher, you succeed to finish and improve my beginning work (as a good friend of course !) while i was taking another direction with color trials...

What is interesting is that we have here two very pertinent proposals where each one owns its proper rendition and feeling, with very different meanings :

1. your B&W version is more emotional and talks about people and relationships, there's a clear connection between the two couples and the bench :



091d1888eeaetwo%20couples%20one%20bench.jpg

2. while my color version is more about urban geometry and loneliness, here people don't really matter, the most important pattern is the repetition of horizontal and vertical lines which separate characters, associated to a violent light which provokes some confusion :

6f014dd81152f59006c7a20837011aa.jpg


Cedric,

You are most kind! I now can see clearly your own vision. not having explained in advance really helped challenge me as to your motives, intent, difficulties and therefore needs. As a consequence, I was on my own and succeeded in finding a special relationship.

I learned a lot from this. By knowing nothing and faced with an image, we construct a story based, sometimes more on our own personal priorities and esthetics, not the author's needs. The tough exercise is fruitful, enfin, but challenging!

Thanks for providing that challenge. It's in a way, he foil against which we can test our new ways of thinking.

Asher
 

Chris Nelson

New member
I think you did a very good job with composition. And balancing a very asymmetrical image, which is something I find normally underappreciated in photography.
 
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