Dare I

I'm not feeling well. Bored and no one to talk to.
I'm also using this forum for therapy. I've been told to behave. I'm doing my best. I've been told to listen to advise. I'm doing my best.
I took a new look at the UK while I was there in June. A different approach. I think it worked but I need your feedback.
Please feel free to tear me to shreds. I need it as part of the therapy. Apparently.
I have the straight jacket on and locked. promise.

More on the same theme later.

Cheers
Tom

What I see is a junction between the old and the new, the intruder into the reality, the contrast of modern life in a world built around a movie set, a fantasy, another time and place. Nothing seems as it is. There is a layer of commonplace overlaying the tapestry of a distant past. People go about their daily business paying little heed to their surroundings, yet the likes of me is trying to look through that and get a glimmer of the past. But the surface activity only provides a transparency to what used to be. The architecture is all that remains. The New has carves it's place into the old. They are not as one, but still remain distinct and vivid in the visual sense. It's a cartoon with the characters pasted on to a landscape they don't quite belong.

I'm reminded somewhat of The Truman Show or Stepford Wives where the scenery is a falsehood and so are the people but neither really match. One part is always out of place or out od step. We use ancient monuments for modern behavior. The fashions of one generation don't apply to another. It's like living in a theme park or a museum.
It's almost comical and a little tragic.

Tom, I think you have here a nice set of 3 images.
I would say that you should not post more until theses are "worn out", commented and dissected.
At first glance and without reading your text I guessed these images were in UK or Republic of Ireland. So here is a good point for you Tom. The sense of place is there.
All images have the same tones and treatment what I think to be another nice bonus.

The first one looks to me that it is suffering of barrel distortion. However I may be wrong...
It is an urban scene like the others following.

On the second one I think the perspective is there but the composition fails a bit. (It is easy to criticize !)
I would have waited until the couple on the left move a bit more to the left and then... click
Or perhaps make a sequence of images and on the computer choose the best one.
I would like to see someone in a prominent place in counterpoint to the far end perspective of the street.

The one I like best is no doubt the last one. It is a nice urban picture, a moment of life.
People waiting for somebody else. Makes us to ask whom are they waiting for ? Perhaps the girl's father who knows ?
The slight tele effect works here nicely. (am I saying something wrong ?)

Do not go down Tom. You have nice images here !

Antonio Correia said:

Tom, I think you have here a nice set of 3 images.
I would say that you should not post more until theses are "worn out", commented and dissected.
At first glance and without reading your text I guessed these images were in UK or Republic of Ireland. So here is a good point for you Tom. The sense of place is there.
All images have the same tones and treatment what I think to be another nice bonus.

The first one looks to me that it is suffering of barrel distortion. However I may be wrong...
It is an urban scene like the others following.

On the second one I think the perspective is there but the composition fails a bit. (It is easy to criticize !)
I would have waited until the couple on the left move a bit more to the left and then... click
Or perhaps make a sequence of images and on the computer choose the best one.
I would like to see someone in a prominent place in counterpoint to the far end perspective of the street.

The one I like best is no doubt the last one. It is a nice urban picture, a moment of life.
People waiting for somebody else. Makes us to ask whom are they waiting for ? Perhaps the girl's father who knows ?
The slight tele effect works here nicely. (am I saying something wrong ?)

Do not go down Tom. You have nice images here !

Click to expand...

Thank you Antonio. I will take your comments to bed with me and sleep with them.

Tom dinning said:

Thank you Antonio. I will take your comments to bed with me and sleep with them.

Click to expand...

Do not sleep during day time !

The first one holds no interest tome what so ever. It may be as much a cultural thing as observational. The second and third shots I find a bit "over-processed" to where the sharpness becomes a distraction rather than a compliment. As with the first, the commonality of the scene has nothing to "grab' my attention, therefore has little to hold my interest long enough to become immersed in the setting.

The third shot I find the most successful, and really more representative of my own vision of what constitutes "street" photography. The building is old, a bit worn and a bit boring; the mother is a bit old, a bit worn and quite bored; the child is simply bored. There is seemingly nothing in their immediate setting to suggest further joy when this moment has passed, thus you've captured that singular defining moment, and for that alone, I applaud the shot.

Tom dinning said:

_DSC2548 by tom.dinning1, on Flickr​

Click to expand...

This one, Tom, is most boiled down to the essence of the feeling of. "Isolated" that suffuses the first of the series. The latter, by having "tasks" for some to be occupied with, still works well, but the second one is so much more focused.

The final one can still carry the same motif, given the same over-processing, (not used negatively), also fits in, but as an extension of the motif. Folk are isolated, but everyone has there separate goal and each discounts the presence of anyone else, save to avoid them!

Now I ask, "What's the relevance, if any, of the strong processing to the successful expression of this idea of "Isolation", (assuming that label is anywhere near apt)?

I'd like to see the second image processed "normally" and also with b. g. softened, to see how the ideas in the image are read differently.

Asher

Tom, you can talk this type of image up all you want but they are still coming across as banal and Flickr-esque. I see nothing of interest here, in fact I see this on my high street all the time why do I need to see this in a photograph?!
Flickr is full to the brim with mundane images like this and they're all representative of what is wrong with photography because they show nothing of a concerted effort, they're just snaps.
I think I know why you have tried to 'glamourise' them with an over processed HDR effect, and that is because you have no belief in what you are seeing in these images yourself, regardless of what you say about them. Otherwise, if they did represent what you say, you wouldn't have the need to do it...
The HDR effect is a subconscious act in trying to make a failed image into something a little more interesting...unfortunately that never works. HDR never works at the best of times either...IMO of course.

Now dons flame retardant suit...

Let me take you all back to the top of the thread. Perhaps you thought Tom "ranted" and skipped that part! Actually, his introduction is the fabric of the pictures.


Now could he have expressed these ideas better? Was HDR needed to being out the apparent "isolation"? These a worthwhile topics to explore.

Tom dinning said:

I'm not feeling well. Bored and no one to talk to.

I'm also using this forum for therapy. I've been told to behave. I'm doing my best. I've been told to listen to advise. I'm doing my best.

I took a new look at the UK while I was there in June. A different approach. I think it worked but I need your feedback.

Please feel free to tear me to shreds. I need it as part of the therapy. Apparently.
I have the straight jacket on and locked. promise.

Click to expand...

Of course, Paul, you're so right. We can find pictures like this populating Flickr! First let's put aside originality. Very odd, I admit, in a critique of a photograph. But the pictures Tom offers might be best looked at as "Conceptual Art", where the picture is not even, in itself demanding to be saved! Go along with me on this path.

For conceptual Art, we're challenged beyond the simplified mundane character of the delivered physical work. Yes anyone could take urinal and declare it art! However, the Duchamp's idea behind it, "a finger to the art establishment", (nowhere to be found in an actual urinal), still carried along with it very well.

Here, with these 3 ordinary photographs, Tom Dinning, the artist, is self-declared to be both isolated and depressed. The pictures mirror that isolation. Flickr does not have that "package". Both messages here go together.





So, I read this three pictures as merely "Words from Tom Dinning". In that narrow context, they all work very well for me.

Having said that, I am still much more keenly interested in how the pictures with this theme of "Isolation" in mind, (if that's what it represents, more or less, might be far better designed and composed to elevate them way above ordinary snaps.

How does limited plane of focus versus HDR full definition down to the last smudge serve to build the aura needed for the theme? To me at least, I'd have isolated the people but that's just my impulsive first thought!

Asher

That was a great nights sleep. I'm refreshed, had my first sip of strong black coffee and breakfasting with Christine in the warming tropical us.

Firstly, let me reassure you all that nothing here has offended me, nor concerned me all that much. It seems the extra dose of citalopram is working at last. Maybe the extra shot of whiskey last night helped it along the way.

Next. HDR was IN NO WAY used in the making of these photos. The dynamic range of the camera is reflected accurately in the final product. The exact method of digital processing was determined to my satisfaction and then used as a preset for the rest, of which these three are part of a cluster of about 20 images that covered my thoughts, feelings and anxiety at the time of shooting.

Next. It's interesting how reflections on the same image can be so far removed from my own ideas. None of these images will ever see the light of day and were not recorded as a gift to the world, but I was, in a moment of weakness, drawn to the thoughts of others. Now I know why I don't bother.

Absolutely nothing against what any of you have said but Paul summed it up nicely when he indicated the irrelevance of the photos to him. Sometimes we do things just for our own inner reasons and they will never be fully understood by others.

The comments from each of you are somewhat expected. Antonio's attention to technical detail and composition was par for the course. I appreciate that, Antonio, but I'm not a beginner at this game. What is there is what is there. You nor I can change that, nor do I want to. The photographs are presented as a complete product as an artist might present the complete canvas or the writer presents the final edition.

I do see the final shot as very typically, a representation of 'street' photography. Certainly the photos were taken in the street but that's where it ends.

As for the remainder of Paul's comments, I can only suggest he try some of my medication.
For someone who is so far off the mark in regard to what criticism is, he sure is emotional about it. That sort of logic will get you nowhere, Paul. The photos aren't about you and your opinions. It's about reflecting the facts and considering the artists intent. Judgements certainly come into it somewhere. They are hard to avoid. But judgements based on personal taste or poorly considered assumptions such as "glamourising them with an over processed HDR effect" don't mean much and aren't really helpful to either of us. Still, I appreciate the effort. Keep the fire proof suit on for a while.
And lastly, I'm inclined to think that when I take photographs there are many 'subconscious' processes going on. They are certainly not 'unconscious' and often I find myself doing something that I discover later I was not conscious of at the time. But surely that's a legitimate way of working? I'm not a big fan of 'over cooking' photos but I do it from time to time to push my own boundaries and explore new ones. How sad that would be if we didn't. I was once told by someone we all know that converting a shot to B&W was a default for a poorly taken shot and those who avoided the use of color in this day and age hadn't reach a proper understanding of the function of color. What do you think of that?

I post photos in OPF for discussion. These have certainly opened up some discussion. I'm happy to continue for as long as I don't feel the urge to play with a rope and a ladder.

Thank you all for your feedback. You are all lovely people. Truly!

Tom

Asher Kelman said:

Let me take you all back to the top of the thread. Perhaps you thought Tom "ranted" and skipped that part! Actually, his introduction is the fabric of the pictures.


Now could he have expressed these ideas better? Was HDR needed to being out the apparent "isolation"? These a worthwhile topics to explore.

Of course, Paul, you're so right. We can find pictures like this populating Flickr! First let's put aside originality. Very odd, I admit, in a critique of a photograph. But the pictures Tom offers might be best looked at as "Conceptual Art", where the picture is not even, in itself demanding to be saved! Go along with me on this path.

For conceptual Art, we're challenged beyond the simplified mundane character of the delivered physical work. Yes anyone could take urinal and declare it art! However, the Duchamp's idea behind it, "a finger to the art establishment", (nowhere to be found in an actual urinal), still carried along with it very well.

Here, with these 3 ordinary photographs, Tom Dinning, the artist, is self-declared to be both isolated and depressed. The pictures mirror that isolation. Flickr does not have that "package". Both messages here go together.

How does limited plane of focus versus HDR full definition down to the last smudge serve to build the aura needed for the theme? To me at least, I'd have isolated the people but that's just my impulsive first thought!

Asher

Click to expand...

The feeling of isolation was mine, Asher, not that of the place or people in it. I was feeling quite isolated from the world in general at the time. Looking through the camera and taking shots, then viewing them immediately, a luxury we didn't have 20 years ago, the camera seemed to have the ability to stop the people as as though they were dummies in a shop window. It was as though I was the only thing alive and everything else was window dressing, including the buildings and the people. Reality became the photo and not the other way around. I clicked away for hours, mostly at random and only with the intent of capturing what appeared at first glance and not a considered study . As this process evolved I felt myself recording history but the history was a set up, a fake, and I was caught in the scene, isolated from w living, moving, dynamic world I once knew and now the only living thing in a plastic, meaningless place where all things were posed. Even down to the small child sitting on the post office steps. I imagined she had been placed there in the morning like a prop on a stage and she will be taken away at night and dusted off to repeat the whole thing again tomorrow. And now I'm wondering through this with a rather scary feeling of loneliness and isolation, no one to talk to or comfort me or explain what the hell is going on.

All this is a normal days work in the head of Tom Dinning. Whether I am successful at projecting that to others is incidental. I take the photos in the hope that they will help me understand. Sometimes they do. Most times they raise more issues which I can then photograph and ponder.

Maybe that's my isolation.
Cheers
Tom

It's satisfying to me that we have strong opinions and no one here is too timid to give honest feedback. Some might be painful at times, but it's so important to have the divergent opinions, or else, we'd never get out of our comfy chair!

Asher

Tom dinning said:

I'm not feeling well. Bored and no one to talk to.
I'm also using this forum for therapy. I've been told to behave. I'm doing my best. I've been told to listen to advise. I'm doing my best.
I took a new look at the UK while I was there in June. A different approach. I think it worked but I need your feedback.
Please feel free to tear me to shreds. I need it as part of the therapy. Apparently.
I have the straight jacket on and locked. promise.

_DSC2577 by tom.dinning1, on Flickr​

More on the same theme later.

Cheers
Tom

Click to expand...

Hello Tom

If you are bored it is probably because you are thinking too much about yourself! Are you asking for feedback regarding your pictures or do you need some advice about your state of mind?

James Lemon said:

Hello Tom

If you are bored it is probably because you are thinking too much about yourself! Are you asking for feedback regarding your pictures or do you need some advice about your state of mind?

Click to expand...

My pictures reflect my state of mind, James. I'm OK with admitting that Its about me. Who else is as important?

Asher Kelman said:

It's satisfying to me that we have strong opinions and no one here is too timid to give honest feedback. Some might be painful at times, but it's so important to have the divergent opinions, or else, we'd never get out of our comfy chair!

Asher

Click to expand...

I haven't found a comfy chair yet, Asher. I've grown so used to the hair coat I look forward to putting it on each morning.

Tom dinning said:

My pictures reflect my state of mind, James. I'm OK with admitting that Its about me. Who else is as important?

Click to expand...

Jim,

I'd argue that almost all art is part of our own "self", projected and filtered into our carefully selected choices in photography. Tom is just not hiding anything!

Asher

Asher Kelman said:

Jim,

I'd argue that almost all art is part of our own "self", projected and filtered into our carefully selected choices in photography. Tom is just not hiding anything!

Asher

Click to expand...

If one cuts oneself one bleeds.
If I speak I also bleed.
Some days its hurts to speak. I fight the pain.
I know full well my photos are inadequate. Not in the technical sense. That's easy stuff. As Christine says, anyone can take a photo. My search is not in the detail but for in the ambivalence and its restitution. In doing so I hope to find some peace.

Tom dinning;156467 said:

If one cuts oneself one bleeds.
If I speak I also bleed.
Some days its hurts to speak. I fight the pain.

Click to expand...

Tom,

You remind me of the piercing song by Alanis Morissette, "You Learn".

How true
Almost every picture I have taken in the last 30 years has stimulated some thoughts in my head that I have the urge to say or write. It may be superfluous to others but absolutely necessary for me before the image is complete (ie, www.notesfromthecamera.blogspot.com).
It may not conventional or conformist but you know me and rules.
I'd far prefer people to talk about themselves than to be picky about framing and processing.
My old man would say: if it doesn't interest you, get interested or you'll just be a boring little **** like the rest of those who look up their own arse for enlightenment