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  #1  
Old March 2nd, 2007, 05:25 PM
Eric Hiss Eric Hiss is offline
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Default OS-X non supported RAW files - can you roll your own?

Hi,
I've seen a lot lately about various hacks to the Raw.plist file to trick the OS into recognizing non-supported camera RAW files such as the Leica M8. Unfortunately this trick is not working for my leica DMR....but after seeing how simple the file structure is, it seems like this should be an easy go to create one. The color matix information is available from the Dcraw source code which does open the leica DMR files.

Of course many things that look simple are not.... What I'm hoping for is that someone reading this group that knows more will be able to help out. Stan are you out there?
Thanks!
Eric
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  #2  
Old March 3rd, 2007, 09:11 PM
Stan Jirman Stan Jirman is offline
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I can assure you that it's quite impossible. While you may get lucky (like the good old days of 10D and 300D), but there's much more to it. Being patient and waiting for a software update is your best remedy.
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  #3  
Old March 4th, 2007, 12:12 PM
Eric Hiss Eric Hiss is offline
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Hi Stan,
Thanks for your reply even if it isn't too encouraging. I have read that most of apple's raw conversion is taken from Dcraw and dcraw does provide support for the DMR.....so is it really so far fetched to think that most of the information needed is already there?

Be Patient?
Well I believe I've certainly been patient enough, having already waited for more than a year now with no word from Apple. How can I know that they will ever provide support for the Leica DMR? And how I am supposed to get my work done in the mean time? I am ready to scrap aperture in favor of lightroom as at least that works with most of the raw files. Apple is really missing their chance with aperture by not getting the support for pro cameras in place sooner. Don't get me wrong...I like it or at least the potential of it. But what happens when the latest and greatest camera comes out at PMA next week. Does Apple think they have a year or two to provide support? C1, Bibble, Silkypix, ACR/lightroom will have it in weeks if not even before the camera is actually available. And you can't tell me these guys have more resources than Apple does. Aperture is a great program even though there are some glaring problems with it like not being able open two library's at once, and a whole bunch of small problems like not being able to save your workspace how you like it. I'm ready to be patient while they fix those kinds of things, however I can't wait much longer for RAW file support especially when they won't publically state which cameras they will and won't support.

I got it straight from Joseph Shorr that they are working on the mass produced cameras first. If they are working as slow as they are and one considers the upgrade pace of the new cameras, then its a safe bet that they will never get to most of the pro cameras which will be sold in much lower volumes. That's why I am looking to find a way to build my own support before I scrap the whole thing as a woeful waste of time.

Eric
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  #4  
Old March 4th, 2007, 04:40 PM
Stan Jirman Stan Jirman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Hiss View Post
Well I believe I've certainly been patient enough, having already waited for more than a year now with no word from Apple.
I was referring mainly to the M8, which is hardly a year old. The DMR is in a category of its own.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Hiss View Post
How can I know that they will ever provide support for the Leica DMR? And how I am supposed to get my work done in the mean time?
I am naturally not speaking for Apple, but this is how I deal with any company, with any purchase: Assume I get what I see, and everything else is bonus. This applies to cameras, my TiVo Series 3 (which is the biggest joke I ever bought in many respects), cars, and software.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Hiss View Post
I am ready to scrap aperture in favor of lightroom as at least that works with most of the raw files. Apple is really missing their chance with aperture by not getting the support for pro cameras in place sooner.
Don't tell me - tell Apple. But having said that, quite honestly, I don't think that Apple is missing out too much by not supporting the DMR. While it may be extraordinarily painful for you, the lack of DMR support is painful for you and two other people. It's like me complaining about repair options to my Audi in the middle of Wyoming. It totally sucks, but that's about the extent of it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Hiss View Post
I got it straight from Joseph Shorr that they are working on the mass produced cameras first. If they are working as slow as they are and one considers the upgrade pace of the new cameras, then its a safe bet that they will never get to most of the pro cameras which will be sold in much lower volumes.
Joe is the best public spokesperson for the product, so you clearly went to the right person, but I don't think that your point is fair. Look at each software update - it contains support for NEW cameras, as well as for a small number of older cameras. Now that "old" number may not be promising to you, but fact is that few people create new work with old, not mainstream cameras. Supporting a D30 is more relevant because there are still consumers in reasonably large numbers shooting it; DMR? Probably fewer - and these customers often have their own, entrenched workflows anyway.
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  #5  
Old March 4th, 2007, 05:02 PM
Eric Hiss Eric Hiss is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Jirman View Post
I was referring mainly to the M8, which is hardly a year old. The DMR is in a category of its own.
Actually people have successfully hacked the Raw.plist file for the M8 including the color matrix. Certainly that gave me hope that I could get the DMR going too since it uses a similar sensor from Kodak.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Jirman View Post
I am naturally not speaking for Apple, but this is how I deal with any company, with any purchase: Assume I get what I see, and everything else is bonus. This applies to cameras, my TiVo Series 3 (which is the biggest joke I ever bought in many respects), cars, and software.

Good point, but when I bought aperture they advertised that they would be providing support for all pro cameras. Actually besides Canon and Nikon, what pro cameras are they supporting. Do they support any MF backs?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Jirman View Post
Don't tell me - tell Apple. But having said that, quite honestly, I don't think that Apple is missing out too much by not supporting the DMR. While it may be extraordinarily painful for you, the lack of DMR support is painful for you and two other people. It's like me complaining about repair options to my Audi in the middle of Wyoming. It totally sucks, but that's about the extent of it.
No idea how many DMR's were sold but more than just a few and probably more than certain MF digital backs...Anyhow, I've told it straight to Joseph Schorr who gave me his business card and told me to e-mail him which I did. Never heard back. Of course I've put it into the user feedback box many times along with a list of other things.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Stan Jirman View Post
Joe is the best public spokesperson for the product, so you clearly went to the right person, but I don't think that your point is fair. Look at each software update - it contains support for NEW cameras, as well as for a small number of older cameras. Now that "old" number may not be promising to you, but fact is that few people create new work with old, not mainstream cameras. Supporting a D30 is more relevant because there are still consumers in reasonably large numbers shooting it; DMR? Probably fewer - and these customers often have their own, entrenched workflows anyway.
When I met him at SFdig, he was just as frustrated with some things as I was and had his own hacks to make things work. Look, I liked the guy and am strong proponent for Apple in general, but I find no reason to prop them up on this when so many other photo applications open the leica files. If they are so uncommon why would these other groups provides support for them?
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  #6  
Old March 13th, 2007, 08:35 PM
Stan Jirman Stan Jirman is offline
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Well, with 10.4.9 out you can see that they added Leaf back support. So I guess they are targeting the less popular (by numbers) cameras. Hard to tell what that indicates, but it's a data point :)
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