Bruised Fruit

[Matt Halstead]

Hi guys,

Would appreciate feedback on these two images before I issue to the model.

Many thanks

 

[Asher Kelman]

Hi guys,

Would appreciate feedback on these two images before I issue to the model.

Many thanks

This is shocking! I hope that she was not in an accident or abused. What's the real or fictional story? One cannot comment on this without knowing the purpose.

Hmm! Come to think of it, you are a stager of events! So this could just be makeup. In any case, the intent and final use of the pictures is critical before an opinion can be formed, at least in my mind.

Asher

 

[Sandrine Bascouert]

You cannot be insensitive, being a woman, watching those images. Usually I'm not in Explanations but there, I need it.

 

[Asher Kelman]

You cannot be insensitive, being a woman, watching those images. Usually I'm not in Explanations but there, I need it.

Sandrine, what difference to humanity whether our eyes are in a male or female head? Why does, "being a woman" make such a difference? I hope you have never know such abuse!

Asher

 

[Matt Halstead]

All makeup and special effects.

 

[Asher Kelman]

All makeup and special effects.

What's the difference here?

Asher

 

[Sandrine Bascouert]

Because the first thing I see there is "she has been beaten" - By a man. You first thought of an accident, that the difference.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Because the first thing I see there is "she has been beaten" - By a man. You first thought of an accident, that the difference.

Sandrine,

Why by a man? It could have been by a bear or a boa constrictor or even a woman. Statistically, I admit, it has more chance of being the result of abuse by a man.

Matt,

Those bruises are very well made. The yellow of broken down blood components seeping to the periphery of the skin is outstanding. To me, the flowers did not matter, as I was so concerned for the girl, especially as you ask for opinions before you give her the pictures!

If your name was not on the page, I'd swear this was real! Well it's real, but just real artistry! I'd have cut the number of bruises on her left arm. The one on the right clavicle is spectacular. Why none on her face? Why none on the back of her hands and arms as if she might be defending herself?

Asher

 

[charlie chipman]

Looking at this from a photographers point of view, which sometimes I find annoying yet can't seem to avoid, the first thing I noticed as I scrolled down the page is that it looks as though her face has been retouched in what's typical of glamour/fashion photographers. Blurred skin, glowingly white eyes. For me this takes away from the believability of this scene.

Because the first thing I see there is "she has been beaten" - By a man. You first thought of an accident, that the difference.

I'm a man.

The story that ran through my thoughts first was that she had been beaten by a man and is willingly waiting for this same man to come back her. Next I thought maybe she had been kidnapped and beaten by a man and is being held hostage, then I thought perhaps she is a masochist of some sort.

I'd have cut the number of bruises on her left arm. The one on the right clavicle is spectacular. Why none on her face? Why none on the back of her hands and arms as if she might be defending herself?

I do agree Asher, particularly with the number of bruises on her left arm. Also the bruises don't quite match up from picture to picture.

I wonder who of the involved parties is the creator of this concept and what their intentions are. Does the photographer want to show a beaten and bruised young girl, does the model want pictures of herself all bruised up? That is where my curiosity lays.

 

[Sandrine Bascouert]

I left the thread with my answer yesterday and then I went to sleep. Asher, I knew you will answer that and I was thinking of possible answers while drowning into my bed; here it is...

In all my life, and because I've lived a life a bit adventurous when I was a young woman, I know what a man can do to a woman, for the sake of what he calls love and that everybody's around would call excessive jealousy. I also knew some prostitutes that were some of my neighbours and saw many times a herd of men "chasing" their preys (and god knows it's not easy to run with high heels - bad joke). I also know that some of the women are addicted to "love" and made them masochistic. Hopefully I never experienced that myself. What the hell do you think no woman unless stupid would accept a drink from a complete stranger? But what I don't know is why are we so weak?*

From the point of view of these photographies, I'll made a statement, and I will be a bit GROSS.

It all have to do with our inner fears...A woman has a inner fear of something, a man of something else. it's the same with people from different cultures, fears and blessings are different.

Lets's see the image:
When you think about Robert Mapplethorpe's image called the devil (or something like that).
As a woman I see a mad guy with a whip in is arsehole, which is a strange and probably painful way to play the devil.
My husband is unable to watch this image, he is just able to glance at it, and he is not prude...I asked to a friend of mine who is gay, and I asked him. He told me that this is a kind of picture that he expected to be shown in a pornography magazine, but it made him uncomfortable at some point. I saw that differently, for me it was not even sexual, for men it was. that's a difference.

I don't show the image but you will be able to find it quite easily.

*- I had another neighbour, old man, who always said that "why are we so weak?" - seeing all that violence. He never asked why are THEY so weak, he said WE. I knew later that he was Jewish but "retired" from the community. I never knew why he used to repeat this sentence from a personal situation or because he included himself in all the cowardice of the people around.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Sandrine,

Look want passion Matt's pictures, for all their possible shortcomings, succeeded in stirred in you.[

QUOTE=Sandrine Bascouert;105869]I left the thread with my answer yesterday and then I went to sleep. Asher, I knew you will answer that and I was thinking of possible answers while drowning into my bed; here it is...

In all my life, and because I've lived a life a bit adventurous when I was a young woman, I know what a man can do to a woman, for the sake of what he calls love and that everybody's around would call excessive jealousy. I also knew some prostitutes that were some of my neighbours and saw many times a herd of men "chasing" their preys (and god knows it's not easy to run with high heels - bad joke). [/quote]

Women make themselves attractive to be noticed and the men simply go after the bait. That's nature. We're lucky that, after mating females don't do the spider thing and eat the male for nutrition or simply to prevent boasting! Some men are overburdened with drive or malice and direct it against women. That's unfortunate tragedy of design.

I also know that some of the women are addicted to "love" and made them masochistic. Hopefully I never experienced that myself.

Their addiction to love may have a survival advantage. More resources to raise her young.

What the hell do you think no woman unless stupid would accept a drink from a complete stranger?

I disagree strongly! Lot's of smart women size up a guy and make it apparent that such an invitation might be entertained. That's part of choosing a lifelong mate!

I offered coffee and it worked! LOL

From the point of view of these photographies, ...

It all have to do with our inner fears...A woman has a inner fear of something, a man of something else. it's the same with people from different cultures, fears and blessings are different.

Lets's see the image: Do you mean Matt's photograph or the Maplethorpe image?

*- I had another neighbour, old man, who always said that "why are we so weak?" - seeing all that violence. He never asked why are THEY so weak, he said WE. I knew later that he was Jewish but "retired" from the community. I never knew why he used to repeat this sentence from a personal situation or because he included himself in all the cowardice of the people around.

Bravery is often for mythologies or the passion and fear of battle, but it's not common. Men as easily cower as risk everything for a cause.

Asher

 

[Matt Halstead]

Guys,

I'm always pleased to create debate. I will provide an informed explanation of my images later this evening.

Best,

 

[Sandrine Bascouert]

Asher, maybe it's not a question of male/female opposition
It's more an opposition of latin/anglo-saxon behaviour

What I said, I saw it, I don't invented it
some women are wicked, I know some, and most of the time they succeed
that don't make them more sympathetic
I just stated what I though were facts
I don't offer any explanations.

but by the way'
the photos presented here need some explanations, and that doesnt add or substract the fact that the lighning is perfect, the model adorable.... But there is a story somewhere.

 

[Sandrine Bascouert]

Again a bad day yesterday....
Pitiful English, awkwardly pride...

As I look through my window, watching the school girls in mini skirts going to school. The school boys at the age where everything have the shape of the forbidden fruit, walking by, taking no notice of their infinite legs. I say to myself, "Yes, this is probably a question of culture"
Yes, the latin male is a prick.
My apologies... .

 

[Rick Greely]

If find this discussion to be interetsing and an example of how we bring our life experiences to what we see in a photograph. I have a background as an alternative health care provider and what I immediately saw was a young woman who had received treatment using a technique known as cupping. From the roundness of the bruising I immediately thought of this modality as the cause. Interesting how we interrupt what we see through the glasses of our own experiences and thoughts.

 

[Andy brown]

Hi Matt,

Beautiful lighting set up and make up but I'm sorry to have to say I find the images completely unconvincing.

For whatever reason, the model just doesn't carry it off. I suspect she is too young and not life weary enough. A bit like what they about dancing the tango.

The concept is sound but I looked at the shots and thought ' She's all innocent but where's the pain? I don't see the pain, emotional or otherwise'.
There's no internal tension in the brow or the jaw, that's not realistic for a young woman who has been subjected to this abuse (and yes, I went straight to a battered lover scenario,...by a man).

Please take my comments in the sprit in which they are intended - to work towards a killer image. It's so close!

Nice work. Andy

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

I'd agree with that, a woman with those kind of bruises even from something as simple as an accident (I find Sandrine's reaction to this photo very disturbing and when I managed a lab the police used to develop photos of the real thing regularly - don't tar us all with the brush of the few!) does not lack the appropriate facial expression or 'look' to match. No one goes through that pain, no one shows the evidence of that pain, with such an innocent and naive expression. The bruises don't make sense either, a bruise that big will have spread far more and the limbs so affected will droop more.

Sorry but my first reaction was 'ps'.

 

[Sandrine Bascouert]

I agree that I maybe over reacted ( a bit of a drama queen sometimes ) but it's the life as i used to see it (calmer now), it's what it's used to be when I was in France, lot of violence. It's a bit of the reason why I left France for Great Britain...

 

[Asher Kelman]

I agree that I maybe over reacted ( a bit of a drama queen sometimes ) but it's the life as i used to see it (calmer now), it's what it's used to be when I was in France, lot of violence. It's a bit of the reason why I left France for Great Britain...

Matt Halstead: Bruised Fruit​

Sandrine,

It's necessary for the pendulum to swing from one side of an argument to another for us to get the full dimensions of human values that are attempted in an emotionally strong image that has been attempted here. It worries me not that at any moment we might be wrong. However it's the hovering around and between all the possibilities and their consequences that allows us to understand the art that has been attempted. In the end it hardly matters that the photograph as currently delivered, (and that could now change), might have serious flaws. What counts is that we investigated this idea!

So in that sense, the picture works, despite any faults in the bruises!

Asher

 

[Sandrine Bascouert]

To me, the flowers add that little something like a funeral. But it's just guessing.