Lastolite umbrella box with hot shoe flash

[Tim Armes]

Hi all,

I currently have a set of Bowens studio lights, but the kit is somewhat clumberson to take on location. I've decided to leave that setup at home and invest in a lightweight kit for "quick" location work. I realise that the results will never be quite as good as with large strobes, however from what I've seen on the Strobist site and Planet Neil, I believe that you can get a good way there.

So I'll be using compact folding light stands, 580EXs and tiltheads to hold the flashes on the stands. Where I'm struggling is in the choice of light modifier. Have any of you had any experience with the Lastolite umbrella box's with small strobes? Do they work well together or would a 580EX simply not have enough power?

Thanks,

Tim

 

[Mike Craven]

Tim,

The Lastolite umbrella box is ideal for location work, I keep 2 plus stands and 580ex`s in a tripod case. See the following web site for more info: http://www.dg28.com/lastolite.html

Mike

 

[Stephen_Pace]

I use the Photek umbrella boxes. Similar to the Lastolites. Differences are:

Removable diffusion. So it can be an umbrella too.

The black cover is removable so it can be a shoot thru unbrella also.

The shaft is in 2 sections that screw together. So one sets it up with the sections together and then unscrews the bottom one and the box can be placed inches from the subject.

I like them and the 580s should be fine for most portraits. Handy for lighting small rooms as they are shallow. Don't shoot at F 22 or try to overpower the sun tho.

Stephen

 

[Asher Kelman]

What about the stability of the "umbrella spokes" of the Lastolite? I don't like things that get distorted!

Also what is the time to assemble for the Lastolite and the Photek. Is that latter heavier given the extra removable layers?

Asher

 

[Frank Doorhof]

On location I use an omnibounce and a reflector like diffuser which is mounted on the lens and gives the flash a more difusse look.

The umbrellas for flash do look tempting, but I find that when on location I always drag my ringflash with me, I'm now so used to it that I don't know any better

 

[Frank Doorhof]

Let me explain a bit more.
The omnibounce is a very simple diffuse unit and works wonders for medium close portraits (not very close), the other device is a nameless unit I got once from a supplier of me, it mounts over the lens and is the sort of translucent screen we also use for the sun outside.

I believe it's a universal method because I have seen it more but I can't find the name that quick.

In theory everything that makes the light diffuse will work, bouncing of the ceiling or off a reflector, preferable white for soft tones.

Greetings,
Frank

 

[Asher Kelman]

Let me explain a bit more.
the other device is a nameless unit I got once from a supplier of me, it mounts over the lens and is the sort of translucent screen we also use for the sun outside.

I believe it's a universal method because I have seen it more but I can't find the name that quick.

In theory everything that makes the light diffuse will work, bouncing of the ceiling or off a reflector, preferable white for soft tones.

Greetings,
Frank

Frank,

Thanks for the clarification. I have a problem with the word, "over". Do you mean "over" like screwing in a UV filiter to the front of a lens? Or "Over" such as the flash is mounted above the camera on the horseshoe mount.

If it is on the lens itself, I guess it is just a softening filter.

Maybe you have a picture of your setup.

Asher

 

[Frank Doorhof]

Hi,
Sorry for the translation.

I have a picture here :

I like the outcome of this unit, coupled with an omnibounce for even more softness.

 

[Stephen_Pace]

Also what is the time to assemble for the Lastolite and the Photek. Is that latter heavier given the extra removable layers?

Asher


Not too heavy. The shorter shaft is nicer to the stand, less leverage. I've used them on lowel omni stands. Stability was ok. Wouldn't want to use anything less. Set up time isn't bad either. For run and gun, you can't beat a stofen. And the come in Tungsten and Florecenet flavors too.

S

 

[Tim Armes]

In theory everything that makes the light diffuse will work, bouncing of the ceiling or off a reflector, preferable white for soft tones.

Hi Frank,

It's perhaps a matter of semantics or perhaps me being pedantic, but "everything that makes the light diffuse will work" is incorrect if by that you mean "everything that makes the light diffuse will make the light soft".

Unless of course you mean something else when you say "will work".

Soft light needs a large light source. A Soften, for example, diffuses light; however it still provides a hard light source (when used directly) because it is still small. The light is slightly more diffuse and so the shadows have softer edges, but it far from providing a soft light source.

So to be clear one should say "Any large source of light (relative to the subject) will provide soft lighting. A small strobe may be bounced off a ceiling, wall, umbrella or other large diffuser, preferably white for soft tones, to provide a soft light."

Tim

 

[Asher Kelman]

Soft light needs a large light source. A Soften, for example, diffuses light; however it still provides a hard light source (when used directly) because it is still small. The light is slightly more diffuse and so the shadows have softer edges, but it far from providing a soft light source.

So to be clear one should say "Any large source of light (relative to the subject) will provide soft lighting. A small strobe may be bounced off a ceiling, wall, umbrella or other large diffuser, preferably white for soft tones, to provide a soft light."

Tim

Hi Tim and Frank, both of you are partially correct.

The set up here makes the front of this diffuser the new original light source from which all the principal light will diverge. It is of course surounded by 3 other lights. The reflected lighted from the room and the surounding low intensity light of the diffuser.

The new central bright light area is now the source and has about 4-6 times the surface area and is closer to the subject so it will be less hard, in itself.

Asher

 

[Ray West]

time for a simple experiment - using a torch (hand lamp) and a plastic alkathene lid. (diffuser)
1) moving the diffuser away from the light source, towards the subject blurs the peripheral shadows, but does not soften the central shadows so much as I expected.
2) the direct light is reduced, light being reflected from the back of the plastic.
3) the sharp edges of the light source (i.e. the bright centre spot of the torch) are diffused about the same amount, whatever distance the light source is from the diffuser.

Pretty obvious, but simple to prove. 1) is obvious, too, when I think about it.

I guess a properly engineered fresnel type lens may give better light transmission, but an old 'tupperware' lid is cheaper... Purely subjective, no physics required!

Best wishes,

Ray

 

[Frank Doorhof]

It depends on the definition you give for softlight.

When I want SOFT soft light I will use a large translucent screen and place a strobe behind it, making my lightsource very large.

However as I understood the idea was here to make it ON camera.
The umbrella's are off course a larger source, but most of the time the small diffuser arround the lens does a good job for 3/4 bodies, for close ups (closer than 1 mtr) I would not use either.
But I would bounce or use of camera flash simply because the on camera flash will be too easy recognizable as on camera. And I love depth in a portrait (one side darker).

You are completly correct with size/distance.
The larger the source the softer the light, the closer a soft source is to a model the softer the light.

For real soft light I use an Elinchrom Octa 1.90mtrs but heck that don't fit my flash on the camera

 

[Sid Jervis]

It depends on the definition you give for softlight.
For real soft light I use an Elinchrom Octa 1.90mtrs but heck that don't fit my flash on the camera

I would not like to be outside with that on a windy day.

 

[Frank Doorhof]

It gives you some beautifull arial shots
Normally I take the assistant I most dislike to hold it.