may have focus problem, request advice.

[Tim Dolan (Longwatcher)]

I could use some advise.
I am trying to figure out if I am imagining things or if my camera (1DsMkII) needs servicing.

Lately I have noticed that all of my pictures appear to be less sharp then they were several months ago. Most recently I was taking pictures of flowers for a project I am working on and the edges all looked softer then normal. Since I was shooting with a 85/1.2L I was frequently at a shutter of 1/2000 or more (occasionally needing to put 3-stop ND filter on). So I know it was not camera shake. If it had been the filter, that would explain it, but it was only on when I needed it and it made little difference overall (except of course to the shutter speed).

About 30 minutes later I was experimenting at a local park with multiple lenses and they all appeared to be not as good as I remembering them being. So if there is a problem it is a high-probability that it would be the camera.

If it was just back or front focus then I should have been able to note that, but there did not seem to be any specific point that was as sharp as I expected it to be and the sharpest point was pretty much where it should have been. I was shooting a line of posts and trees specifically to play with DoF among other things. Not all of my shots were wide open, I was also using f8, which should have provided the best results. I was not seeing a lot of difference in sharpness between wide open and F8. DoF and vignetting yes, focus no.

My problem is I can't think of anything that would be camera related that would cause a general mis-focus problem. I would expect some point to be in focus if the sensor had become mis-aligned.

The strangest thing I noticed was I think my TS-E-24 produced the sharpest images when playing in shift mode (the horizontal one anyway). Still soft though.

And before I forget, I use both PS CS2 and DPP 2.1 and even increased sharpening beyond what I normally use, which just resulted in worse pictures.

I also think I may be imagining things or it was a time of day thing maybe as I usually shoot these types of shots near sunset and this time it was just before to just after noon. I am of course grasping at straws thinking maybe the light was affecting the sharpness, but just in case.

I normally do studio portrait and model sessions so slightly fuzzy pictures can be a plus, so I had not noticed this before and if it was a time of day thing then I am still a bit puzzeled by why that affect sharpness so much. Also haven't had any shoots scheduled since early May.

For trivia: I played with the following lenses:
16-35/2.8L
28-70/2.8L (My standard lens)
70-200/2.8L IS
100-400L
28-135 IS (I just wanted to make sure my backup lens worked)
75-300 IS (same, they worked)
85/f1.2L MkI (only one I used for flower shots, but also used for park shots)
50/f1.4
and the TS-E-24L
Which is just about every lens I have.
All lenses basically worked equally well, except the slight improvement with TS-E-24

I really was hoping to not send the camera in until after I get a second 1 series (hopefully in fall/winter), I am kind of fond of it and my D60/10D as backups just don't cut it anymore. I had planned on sending it in with my 85/1.2L for servicing and calibration together as I am planing on keeping the two married after I get a second 1 series camera body. I do have a window before my next critical shoot in August where I can live with my backup cameras if necessary, but would obviously not want to if it is just my imagination.

I would include sample shots, but given the variables I don't think it will help and I still only have dial-up.

So is it likely my imagination, time of day or might I have an actual problem that requires servicing?

Thanks for any help,

 

[Chuck Westfall(Canon USA)]

Hi, Tim:

Could you perhaps burn a CD with some sample images and send it to me for analysis?


Best Regards,

Chuck Westfall
Director/Media & Customer Relationship
Camera Marketing Group/Canon U.S.A., Inc.

 

[Tim Dolan (Longwatcher)]

Mr. Westfall,
Thanks very much for the offer, that is more then expected.

I think I could get enough on a CD for comparison. I can also burn a DVD+R for that matter - actually easier as I have to find where I stashed my CD-Rs.

I do need a mailing address (I may be able to look it up) to get to you directly and can send out Thursday afternoon at the latest if not before.

I presume you just need the .CR2 raw files?

How much of a sample.
I shot a little over 6 GB (three 2Gb cards plus part of a fourth) last round (raw+M2 jpeg compression level 8) around 500 shots.
Just two or three lenses or as many of mine as I can fit? Definately the 85/f1.2 and the TSE-24 (although I only took a very small number of those). The 28-70 is most recently back from repairs so that would be appropriate also.
Are there any particular shots you would like me to take as well under more controlled conditions before I send.

I am presuming you also need as close as I can get examples from before and now with the same lenses?
If you only need current that would be even easier as I won't have to hook up one of my external drives and look for the earlier raw files.

The flowers are fairly easy as I did a batch last year with my same 1DsMkII and my 85/1.2L just after I got it last summer and they are in a project folder so easy to find.
The park is a bit harder as I was shooting for different purposes and shots from the park are scattered over multiple drives by month.

And as mentioned could be just my imagination, but I lean against that or I would not have posted.

Again thanks, that is more then expected.

 

[Tim Dolan (Longwatcher)]

Update

Update: I am now thinking it was a time of day issue more then anything else.

Because I did not want to waste Mr. Westfield's time on analysis if it was my imagination. I hooked my three most used lenses (28-70/2.8L, 70-200/2.8L IS and the 85/1.2L and up to all three of my Canon digital cameras 1DsMkII, 10D and D60 and performed a ruler test (F1.2 (for the 85L), F2.8 and F8 3-shots each on a tripod with continuous light. Other then noting that my 10D is still aiming about 1/2 inch farther back at 2 meters then my other two cameras (the other two were basically on the money or in this case the 18 on the ruler), I could see no significant focus difference, I had a slight perception that my D60 was doing slightly better, but after some analysis have attributed that to better out of the camera color/contrast. I could see no detail difference between the cameras.

So I went back and looked at all of my flower shots again and took a careful look at details rather then flower edges and overall look as I had before and noted that there was more detail towards the center of the flowers then towards the outside and perception of sharpness was angle of view dependent as well. Also since there was a strange (to me) hazy effect (which I had thought was the shot being slightly out of focvus, despite my proximity to the flowers I am suspecting some sun/atmospheric effect causing the problem. I know simliar things can happen at longer ranges, but at 2-4 feet my brain was obviously having trouble accepting that it could happen at that short of a distance.
Given that it had rained earlier with a high humidity and the sun just coming out from the clouds, I am thinking what I was seeing was light scattering caused by the moisture in the air affecting the apparence of focus.

Does this make sense?

In any case I have eliminated the camera as a sole source to the problem (or all three cameras or all of my lenses are messed up or all of them, which would not surprise it me a lot given my luck lately) and just need to go out again later this week and see if indeed it was time of day and/or humidity (presuming the hurricane/tropical storm doesn't come up this way to Virginia and dump water on my days I can go out.

Sorry to have bothered everyone who read this thread. I was just surprised to take pictures with same camera and same lens of flowers on same rose bushes (obviously different flowers) and get such lousy shots compared to last year's outing. And I had compared it to the previous shot and there was a difference. But if it was the camera I should have seen it in the ruler shots and didn't and I am now thinking I should have done that before starting the thread.

Also, sorry for being long-winded (bad habit - getting better)

 

[Tom Wilk]

I'm glad that you got things sorted out, Tim. I agree that humidity, and especially extreme (near 100%) humidity can give a hazing effect. The camera sees it as we do, but we get to look at the camera's output on the screen at 100% magnification (if magnification's the correct word).

The ruler shot is a good test.

PS - I think I've seen you elsewhere.

 

[nicolas claris]

Sorry to have bothered everyone who read this thread. I was just surprised to take pictures with same camera and same lens of flowers on same rose bushes (obviously different flowers) and get such lousy shots compared to last year's outing. And I had compared it to the previous shot and there was a difference. But if it was the camera I should have seen it in the ruler shots and didn't and I am now thinking I should have done that before starting the thread.

Also, sorry for being long-winded (bad habit - getting better)

Hi Tim
1- I'm also happy that you find out!
2- You don't have to apologize, this kind of posts is also really teaching us...
We all, at one moment or another, have to deal with self questionning, doubts etc.
When an issue or a supposed it is easy to think/accuse the body or the lense or the software or the client or???
You tried your first analysis and asked for advices, naturally and should I say as usual, Chuck did propose to help, and before any other posters have time to comment, you post back and explain that you were wrong (partially) with your analysis.
THIS is really rare, to have someone recognizing - in public - that kind of error.

Thank you for your honesty. This is a big lesson.

 

[Michael Tapes]

I second the comments that Nicolas made. I was going to post a similar messagfe, but he said it all. No apologies needed.

 

[Tim Dolan (Longwatcher)]

PS - I think I've seen you elsewhere.

Perhaps the signature gave it away

or the POTN camera straps.

I asked here because the other forum, while friendly, is likely to get a lot of confused people on it before someone like you would catch on. I figured this forum someone would figure out what was happening faster, although I honestly did not expect a response from Chuck Westfall that fast and especially not that kind of an offer. It was that which made me re-look at my own problem.

 

[Ray West]

Hi Tom,

seeing you were comparing shots with similar from some time ago, I was thinking more of dust on/in the lens. Now, I'm suspecting condensation on the lens. I do not think the camera needs to be much cooler than the air for condensation to take place in high humidity situation.

Best wishes,

 

[Tim Dolan (Longwatcher)]

Ever since visiting Jamaica a couple of years ago, one thing I watch for is condensation in or on the lens (now Jamaica caused some condensation problems), this time none was visible that I could see. I did have to clear the ND filter that I put in my pocket when I pulled it out, but that was proximity to body caused.

What I don't know is if it could be there and I couldn't see it, but I would think not likely. It was pretty clear through the lens from what I could see. I am sticking more to humidity caused light scattering at this point, unless someone tells me I am wrong. Also I was taking pictures of the flowers for at least 30-45 minutes and there was no difference between early and later images, and there would have been if it was moisture on or in the lens as it came up to background tempurture, but since the camera bag had been in my car over night and I don't use a lot of car AC and a short 4 minute drive, it should have been fairly close to ambient temperature already.

Unfortunately the reminants of the tropical storm will be hanging around for awhile apparently, so no outdoor photography for a few days.