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Welcome to the new site. Here's a thread about the update where you can post your feedback, ask questions or spot those nasty bugs!
Promised a lot delivered.. not much
- Thread starter Imants K
- Start date
Kathy Rappaport
pro member
Everyone has different needs
Imant,
Sorry you feel that way, but, each of us in the place of the WWW has different wants, needs and expectations....and like the real world, you get out of the world what you put into it.
Imant,
Sorry you feel that way, but, each of us in the place of the WWW has different wants, needs and expectations....and like the real world, you get out of the world what you put into it.
Doug Kerr
Well-known member
Sveiki, Imants,
I don't think you should feel that way. I think much of your work is very interesting, if not always to my taste.
I don't think you should feel that way. I think much of your work is very interesting, if not always to my taste.
Asher Kelman
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Fine, I'll take your suggestions! 
We try to get things to the right places so people can find what they want. We continually improve the interface and endeavor to cut down the number of sections. We are about to have another go shortly. Still there have to be places for personal journeys (Riskit!), Entry to Digital, and various specialized fora. We have been fusing camera MFRs more and more and I can see that going further.
We'll have all pictures indexed and searchable and new galleries. We're always open to any new constructive ideas.
Asher
We try to get things to the right places so people can find what they want. We continually improve the interface and endeavor to cut down the number of sections. We are about to have another go shortly. Still there have to be places for personal journeys (Riskit!), Entry to Digital, and various specialized fora. We have been fusing camera MFRs more and more and I can see that going further.
We'll have all pictures indexed and searchable and new galleries. We're always open to any new constructive ideas.
Asher
Last edited:
Mitch Alland
Moderator
Asher, I'm afraid Imants is right and feel that this forum could benefit greatly from a redesign. First, I think that "forums" page should be a simple list with obvious categories, so that the verbose forum descriptions, which, contrary to their purpose only serve to make a loser get lost, would be unnecessary. Second, the number of forum should be reduced because there are, as Imants, says, too many catergories, which does stifle discussion. A simple redesign along these line would, in my view, attract a lot more users.
—Mitch/Bangkok
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10268776@N00/
—Mitch/Bangkok
http://www.flickr.com/photos/10268776@N00/
Asher Kelman
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Hi Mitch,
We are in fact redesigning and others do give kind comments and spend some effort. That we appreciate. It's given in a PM. That's the way it's done.
Those who are here know the way and each place has a particular purpose. For example Riskit! gives a new project, rather than a topic a home for long term work for just that photographer's work. We'll make things easier to follow. Some explanations, like for example the introduction to figure studies, is so needed to makes sure we attract one kind of image and not another.
We do combine sections as we learn what's not needed to be split.
Imagine Paris fused together with no artist's district or left bank or London without speaker's corner or the flower market!
So give us ideas by PM. Meanwhile, look for other people's work that has had fewer comments than deserved. That really helps!
Thanks,
Asher
We are in fact redesigning and others do give kind comments and spend some effort. That we appreciate. It's given in a PM. That's the way it's done.
Those who are here know the way and each place has a particular purpose. For example Riskit! gives a new project, rather than a topic a home for long term work for just that photographer's work. We'll make things easier to follow. Some explanations, like for example the introduction to figure studies, is so needed to makes sure we attract one kind of image and not another.
We do combine sections as we learn what's not needed to be split.
Imagine Paris fused together with no artist's district or left bank or London without speaker's corner or the flower market!
So give us ideas by PM. Meanwhile, look for other people's work that has had fewer comments than deserved. That really helps!
Thanks,
Asher
Rod Witten
pro member
So Imants, what floats your boat? How would your Forum work?
John Angulat
pro member
As a relative newcomer...
...I do not find the site cumbersome nor difficult to navigate. Granted, there are a large number of forums but isn't that what the site's name suggests: Forums. A plurality. I don't believe this site was created to serve the wants, needs or desires of any one single photographic endeavor. If you're interested in Portraits, then spend your time there. If larger formats are what you practice, then there's a place for you to share your work and knowlege, etc, etc.
I don't know how others navigate, but as for me the first link I select at every visit is "Recent Posts". You've got a snapshot of everything that's happened since your last visit. How can you make it easier than that?
Asher, please choose your changes with care. This is a splendid forum with genuine heartfelt conversation shared between participants. I imagine you and others placed a tremendous amount of sweat equity into its creation. Do not change for change sake.
Lastly, this may not be the place for everyone, nor will everyone find this place satisfies their needs. There are many forums out there. I'm sure they'll find the place that makes them feel most comfortable.
...I do not find the site cumbersome nor difficult to navigate. Granted, there are a large number of forums but isn't that what the site's name suggests: Forums. A plurality. I don't believe this site was created to serve the wants, needs or desires of any one single photographic endeavor. If you're interested in Portraits, then spend your time there. If larger formats are what you practice, then there's a place for you to share your work and knowlege, etc, etc.
I don't know how others navigate, but as for me the first link I select at every visit is "Recent Posts". You've got a snapshot of everything that's happened since your last visit. How can you make it easier than that?
Asher, please choose your changes with care. This is a splendid forum with genuine heartfelt conversation shared between participants. I imagine you and others placed a tremendous amount of sweat equity into its creation. Do not change for change sake.
Lastly, this may not be the place for everyone, nor will everyone find this place satisfies their needs. There are many forums out there. I'm sure they'll find the place that makes them feel most comfortable.
Ken Tanaka
pro member
I tend to agree with John. I don't really pay any attention to the forum's organization. Like John I look at Recent Posts first and then go from there. I only take note of sections if I want to respond to a post an want to make sure that my response is in-tone and aware of the section in which the original post was made.
I wouldn't presume to suggest a redesign of this forum as I'm not a very frequent participant here, or on any forum. Maybe there place is too fetish-oriented or micro-categorized, but perhaps that's part of its allure to people attracted more to cubicles than to parties. It seems to me that there's far less juvenile noise here than on other photo forums, due in no small part to the place's real-name policy. It's the reason I peak in here regularly.
I would, however, recommend to Asher that he not feel compelled to pander to squeaky wheels. There is an enormous population of people whose primary photographic interests seem to be (a) buying photo equipment and, (b) typing on Internet photo forums. In my opinion the best way to establish OPF as a photographic venue would be to discourage the gear-mongering chatter found nearly everywhere else and encourage discussions of photography, photographers, and photographic bodies of work.
In general, however, OPF is already relatively successful in that regard.
I wouldn't presume to suggest a redesign of this forum as I'm not a very frequent participant here, or on any forum. Maybe there place is too fetish-oriented or micro-categorized, but perhaps that's part of its allure to people attracted more to cubicles than to parties. It seems to me that there's far less juvenile noise here than on other photo forums, due in no small part to the place's real-name policy. It's the reason I peak in here regularly.
I would, however, recommend to Asher that he not feel compelled to pander to squeaky wheels. There is an enormous population of people whose primary photographic interests seem to be (a) buying photo equipment and, (b) typing on Internet photo forums. In my opinion the best way to establish OPF as a photographic venue would be to discourage the gear-mongering chatter found nearly everywhere else and encourage discussions of photography, photographers, and photographic bodies of work.
In general, however, OPF is already relatively successful in that regard.
Ivan Garcia
New member
I too echo John and Ken sentiments.
I do not post very often in this or any other forum. But when I do dive in to the WWW, this is usually my first stop , is like coming home after a long arduous journey, it feels cosy and warm. Moreover, the people within always makes you feel welcome, no matter how long you were absent for. Do not change anything, is perfect as it is.
I do not post very often in this or any other forum. But when I do dive in to the WWW, this is usually my first stop , is like coming home after a long arduous journey, it feels cosy and warm. Moreover, the people within always makes you feel welcome, no matter how long you were absent for. Do not change anything, is perfect as it is.
Asher Kelman
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Thanks John, Rod, Ken and Ivan!
It's good for people to be so comfortable to hang out here, sharing what they love about photography. That makes it a worthy place for all of us.
I have, BTW, some empathy for people used to seeing far less less categories. But we want to get figure studies but not trash, we want beginners but not diverting from work requiring far more experience and skill. Since we are also interested in what makes a photograph work, it does take more categories to separate topics so they can be focused and satisfying. The issue is always navigation to what interests you most! That we want to improve.
Mitch,
I've polished some descriptions and made a succinct introduction to our OPF Welcome Hall here. That should allow anyone to post correctly without studying more than a few lines. We're working on an additional graphic interface to make navigation even easier.
Asher
It's good for people to be so comfortable to hang out here, sharing what they love about photography. That makes it a worthy place for all of us.
I have, BTW, some empathy for people used to seeing far less less categories. But we want to get figure studies but not trash, we want beginners but not diverting from work requiring far more experience and skill. Since we are also interested in what makes a photograph work, it does take more categories to separate topics so they can be focused and satisfying. The issue is always navigation to what interests you most! That we want to improve.
Mitch,
I've polished some descriptions and made a succinct introduction to our OPF Welcome Hall here. That should allow anyone to post correctly without studying more than a few lines. We're working on an additional graphic interface to make navigation even easier.
Asher
Daniel Buck
New member
On the note of "to many sections", I would have to agree. Only reason I'm bringing this topic back up again (from a week of no replies) is because I thought of this forum (and a few others) when I was watching a lecture, called "The Paradox of Choice". Basically what it was describing, is that when people see to many choices, they tend to get befuddled, choose a choice at random, or not choose any of the choices and simply walk away (for a variety of reasons)
If anyone wants to watch the lecture, here it is, it's about an hour long, but worth it in my opinion.
http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/barry_schwartz_on_the_paradox_of_choice.html
If anyone wants to watch the lecture, here it is, it's about an hour long, but worth it in my opinion.
http://www.ted.com/index.php/talks/barry_schwartz_on_the_paradox_of_choice.html
Colleen Vermillion
pro member
I always use the "Recent Posts" features unless I'm posting a new thread. I don't mind the plethora of categories because it gives me an additional hint of the poster's intent. For example the subject "A couple of Es" mystified me until I looked at the category it was in (The Human Form As Art) It's possible a landscape would end up in Riskit! and not Landscape - Travel. Where a post appears gives us a hint of what type of responses a poster would like. Even a Critique Desired prefix might have a different flavor in Landscape - Travel section versus Riskit!
I don't see the categories as that much of a barrier, especially since "Recent Posts" is so accessible.
-Colleen
I don't see the categories as that much of a barrier, especially since "Recent Posts" is so accessible.
-Colleen
Daniel Buck
New member
I agree colleen, I use the 'recent posts' link too (and use similar functions on most of the forums I browse) but as a consequence, I dont' look at what section the threads are posted in, I just look at the titles
leonardobarreto.com
pro member
I also go directly to RECENT POSTS and I also have the feeling that people find interesting questions anywhere they happen to be posted.
The one thing that is a bit hard to do is to see all the images being posted here since you have to decide first by the title of the post if you want to go ahead and open one post and only then you see the image. Many times I find that it is not the one I want to comment, and that there are other images I'm not opening.
I have never seen a forum where you have a thumbnail catalog of images posted.... just brainstorming ...
The one thing that is a bit hard to do is to see all the images being posted here since you have to decide first by the title of the post if you want to go ahead and open one post and only then you see the image. Many times I find that it is not the one I want to comment, and that there are other images I'm not opening.
I have never seen a forum where you have a thumbnail catalog of images posted.... just brainstorming ...
Asher Kelman
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
This is a great approach.
Right now we are looking at ways to better navigate OPF. Once we get there, some simple navigating paradigms will be available.
A recent introduction of Panoramas and Themes in the Entrance Hall puts fascinating high value work available with no effort. That and Recent Posts allow immediate payoff. We'll do better. However, new ideas are welcomed. Our search engine is pretty good but does it work for you? We are considering ways to greatly improve searching. Remember, in OPF we cover such a variety of different work that one task for us to to segregate the most impressive from the casual snap and struggle on a new road. One simple step for everyone is to extend existing posts where possible instead of starting 2-3 new ones. If in doubt start a new one and don't feel bad about it.
We try to consolidate related subjects anyway. Right now we're consolidating about 30 Riskit! threads to 4-5 so that the is a continuity off one topic. We keep the original threads, of course but move comment to the new long term projects for an individual photographer. Thanks to Cem for the hard work!
So yes, user friendly structure is helpful and your ideas are welcome. Please, send a PM for anything radical so we don't get diverted from actual photography!
Asher
leonardobarreto.com
pro member
Asher: The amount of traffic! I just went to Recent Posts and there was a two page result, and I just checked not long ago...
Even with constant visits we will not be able to keep up.... don't know how YOU do it...
Even with constant visits we will not be able to keep up.... don't know how YOU do it...
Asher Kelman
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Him Leonardo,
Cem has been working like a demon consolidating a zillion threads to make the forum more efficient and Riskit! work as "ongoing projects" over time for individual photographers instead of 30 different threads by one photographer on the 4-5 topics. So that generated all the extra threads today as Cem put a notice redirecting traffic to the consolidated posts. So now 4-5 threads replaces scores of individual threads. So the forum will work better.
Asher
Cem has been working like a demon consolidating a zillion threads to make the forum more efficient and Riskit! work as "ongoing projects" over time for individual photographers instead of 30 different threads by one photographer on the 4-5 topics. So that generated all the extra threads today as Cem put a notice redirecting traffic to the consolidated posts. So now 4-5 threads replaces scores of individual threads. So the forum will work better.
Asher
leonardobarreto.com
pro member
But there is more going on... more images and people participation.... which is good...
Cem_Usakligil
Well-known member
Jonathan Hutt
New member
I've been on a 15 month OPF hiatus, so take my observations with a grain of salt.
My biggest gripe is not the number of forums, but the visual "clutter" - there is a great deal of text crammed into every location. Also, it is always confusing at first to see which threads have been stickied.
Of course, these are minor nits. For what it's worth, as I leisurely scrolled through the various boards, the one thing I noticed, above all, was the quality of the postings and writing here. What OPF lacks in traffic, it more than makes up for in the quality of its users.
My biggest gripe is not the number of forums, but the visual "clutter" - there is a great deal of text crammed into every location. Also, it is always confusing at first to see which threads have been stickied.
Of course, these are minor nits. For what it's worth, as I leisurely scrolled through the various boards, the one thing I noticed, above all, was the quality of the postings and writing here. What OPF lacks in traffic, it more than makes up for in the quality of its users.
Asher Kelman
OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Thanks jonathan for the feedback. The clutter comment is valid. We are trying to address that and have already tried to simplify headings. You'll see a further improvement. If you have specific issues, then send me a more detailed note by PM and that will be appreciated!
That's what we want! We hope to improve in all areas and look forward to more of your own great photographs such as you posted today (on rock climbing) to make our pages beautiful and also give people a thrill!
Asher