Legal Threat

[Paul Bestwick]

well.....this is not very layback, however. I had a friend help me out 6 years ago on a shoot which went over a couple of months interstate. All this time later he now sends me a letter of demand for 5K, claiming that is what I owe him as his share. No payment was made at the time as we just basically made enough to cover the high cost of being there. He left in the second last week to travel overseas.
I continued for one more week & a few weeks later we met up in Europe. it is disputed that during this final week, the week after he had left, any money that came in was half his. (there was no mention of this at any time following the promo) Two years later we did another promo. No mention of any money owed at all. Four years later brings us to the present & I get a demand to cough up the bucks in 14 days. At no time were there any written agreements or contracts in any form. Nothing in writing at all. He has no documentation to substantiate his claim. Given the public nature of this forum I am unable to go into any further detail.
Anyone care to comment.

Cheers,

Paul

 

[Don Lashier]

Paul, blow him off - it's the bluff of a desperate man. I wouldn't even respond. You say this guy is your "friend"?

- DL

 

[Paul Bestwick]

Hi Don,

thanks for the encouragement. I have prepared a strongly worded (with legal help) letter to protect myself since part of his correspondence to me threatened to report me to credit agencies...etc. I am hoping that I have cut him off short. (ex friend i guess)

Cheers,

Paul

 

[Ray West]

Hi Paul,

If you can't give the detail, all we can do is guess about what happened. If he was a friend at the time, who helped you for free for a period of time (I can't work out how long he helped, how long you continued afterwards, etc. ) Then after that, if you actually made some money, then, if he was friend, why didn't you pay him then?

I'm not sure of the legal system in your country, but it maybe he can get free legal aid, and you can't. It may be best for you to seek proper legal advice, like right now.

Best wishes,

Ray

Hi Paul - this was sent before the extra info you gave to Don was read by me.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Hi Paul,

Look up the Statute of limitations under your jurisdiction of where this alleged claim occurred. ASAIK

Generally, a two-year statute of limitations applies to the recovery of back pay. In the case of willful violations, a three-year statute of limitations applies.

That's for back pay. Now I cannot imagine that a non-written agreement can have any standing for payment after 6 years, but then I'm not a lawyer!

I have been told it is very important to not engage such a person since you will always be found to have broken some new implied understanding which makes them even angrier.

I'd hust check your notes that you didn't give him an IOU or something concrete which would get into some transaction that extends the statutes of limitations that apply in Australia. I'm sure there are legal aid services where you can get information on what kind of transaction this might come under and then what are the time limits that would apply.

Good luck and I'm sorry you have to go through this!

Asher

 

[Paul Bestwick]

hey Ray,
when I finished that promo, the money was all used. Debt elimination which was the reason for the promo anyhow. Point was we didn't make a stack of cash so move on......which we did.
Next promo we did, (2 years down the track when we met up again) the first expense on my behalf was to purchase & give him a new G4 powerbook. I felt that was a significant gesture. It is just the way we worked.....I had debt, he would help me out with his time. He is a transient type, no comittments, just lives from one gig to the next. Shoots overseas, (illegally with no work permit) Has some good basic skills & could be great but the developement never got beyond the level of competent. Was very useful to have around when I was getting on my feet.
I might add that if he had asked me I would have gladly returned the favour & become involved in a promo to help him out.....but after 4 years of no contact he decides to threaten me.......

Cheers,

Paul

 

[Cem_Usakligil]

Hi Paul,

Just to let you know, based on the info you've provided I believe you have nothing to be afraid of. Good luck in dealing with this sad person, I hope all will be well soon.

Cheers,

 

[Kathy Rappaport]

Empty Threat

If you had not contract and more than a couple years had passed, doesn't sound like there is anything there. In California you only have two years from the date of a business obligation to demand payment or forget it. If you billed for it and it remained unpaid then you could continue claim for it and then have the right to legal process. As for reporting to the credit bureaus, he has no proof you owe him anything. If you had any basis that he might be able to prevail, you could make him an offer to settle without admission of any wrong doing to avoid any legal hassle.

 

[Ray West]

Hi Paul,

Now I get the fuller picture, it is obvious you have you have done all you can, in doing what your lawyer says. These things happen, from time to time, such is life.

Best wishes,

Ray

 

[Tom Henkel]

Sounds like he's trolling for a settlement...

As others have said, I can't speak to your local legal system, but it sure sounds like a thin legal case. Unless this individual can produce written documentation that such an agreement ever existed he's going to have difficulty winning in court. I frankly think he would have to produce multiple, credible, witnesses to get anyone to believe a verbal contract ever existed. Then he would have to explain why he waited so long to pursue legal action -- especially if he can't document previous attempts to collect on the debt. I think it's very unlikely that you would be forced to pay if this went to court.

But there is the question of your reputation. If someone starts spreading a story that you partner with other photographers, then refuse to pay them for their work, it could affect your business. This is one of those situations where a big corporation might offer the guy a settlement in exchange for signing an NDA to never discuss details of the case. Of course the money big corporations have to spend is different from independent photographers. I think you are taking the right path -- send him a stern letter (better if you can get an attorney to send it on your behalf) and hope he goes away.

Tom

 

[MArk Le]

all you have to do (both of you) is pick up the phone and talk because here I see a clear lack of communication between you two.
Look, maybe he misunderstood still believing that the money came in and you just didn't show up. And he did wrong because before you send anything written you supposed to talk about it first.
Sometimes things just grow and grow, most of the time another person gets in the middle pushing things the wrong way.

in any case don't let this ruin your day...

good luck

 

[Tom Henkel]

Not sure I agree....

all you have to do (both of you) is pick up the phone and talk because here I see a clear lack of communication between you two.
Look, maybe he misunderstood still believing that the money came in and you just didn't show up. And he did wrong because before you send anything written you supposed to talk about it first.
Sometimes things just grow and grow, most of the time another person gets in the middle pushing things the wrong way.

in any case don't let this ruin your day...

good luck

The approach Mark suggests is certainly a civil way of addressing the issue. But if there has been legal saber rattling I'd be inclined to toss the whole issue over to my attorney. If you attempt to talk things out, that action could later be positioned as an admission of culpability (it could be debated whether such positioning would stick, but I could see someone trying to make a case that no one would try to work out a solution to payment of a debt if there was no actual debt. So by meeting to discuss the debt you were tacitly admitting there was an unpaid debt).

In the U.S. this is the sort of dispute would wind up in small claims court where a judge usually decides a case based on which party presents most rational explanation of the events. While judges have to decide cases within the context of the law, there is a little more room for interpretation of the circumstances. The lack of documentation and statute of limitations would probably kill this case in the U.S. But I think you would have a stronger case if you could tell a judge that you felt any financial obligation to this individual had been settled at the time his services were rendered and when you received a subsequent demand for payment, you simply turned the matter over to your attorney.

Tom

 

[Paul Bestwick]

thanks Tom,

as you suggest, I am unaware of any debt & given that there is no contract, invoice, or paperwork of any nature it is hard to see the basis for a case.


Cheers,

Paul

 

[Asher Kelman]

My approach would be to ignore him unless your lawyer insists otherwise. Anything you do wil be interpeted by him as your weakness and he will get hungry. This, unfortunately isn't something open to rational discourse from what you have stated. Bringing this up after several years and work together means he is losing his reality and acting in a primitive opportunistic and hunting fashion. He's turning up any possible way of making or extorting cash.

The more you ignore it, the less it is worthwhile for him and he'll find another target. Don't get close to him because he'll then see you are concenred and have some weakness. Also if you do engage, a judge will then see that you wanted to "sort things out". Then comes the wisdomn of Solomon and a "compromize" is suggested that you only have to pay 70% or else the original plus interest! Just don't do it and don't ever mention his name to anyone or you'll get sued too!

Asher

 

[Will_Perlis]

Asher has it right, I think. It sounds like the guy has gone off into the deep end and anything you do after seeking some good legal advice should only be done with that advice.

 

[Paul Bestwick]

great advice & support from my friends here at OPM....thanks to all

Cheers,

Paul

 

[Paul Bestwick]

sheesh..........had another letter arrive today from the dude.

Paul

 

[Asher Kelman]

Did the lawyer tell you to send him a letter, registered or otherwise?

I really don't like the idea of entering into dialog as it established a period that can be claimed to be noegotiation down the road. don't do it any more unless told to and then I'd have the lawyer write, not you. You must, IMHO, have zero contact!

Asher

Asher

 

[Paul Bestwick]

thanks Asher, I agree & now that is it for me. Incommunicado.

Cheers,

Paul

 

[Ray West]

Hi Paul,

If the guy is an unregistered guest here, or even with a false name, then he is already one step ahead. Keep your friends close, your enemies closer. Not surprising he's sent a second letter, in particular as he has had no reply from his first. In the UK, after the claimant's third letter, the court summons arrives, it may be different for you. I hope you did in fact seek and get 'proper legal advice' (this is not the same as asking someone who perhaps works in a solicitor's office to give you a hand to draft a letter), and that you are doing exactly as they said. 'Proper legal advice ', is usually something you have to pay for. Your ex friend is possibly betting you won't do that, or when you do, it's such a mess to sort out that it will cost you more than it's worth. Possibly, with the time he has on his hands, he has read up on this, possibly worked a few angles, found a loophole you are not aware of. Maybe he has sought legal advice, and has been told he has a valid claim.

Best wishes,

Ray

edit - once again replies take time, during which other replies are made....

 

[Paul Bestwick]

at the end of the day Ray, I can definitely afford to see this through & I would rather spend the money on a Lawyer then give in to the guy. Bottom line is, as I have been informed, he has no case. For him to pursue it would be crazy given he will end up with my legal fees as well as his own.

Thanks Ray,

Paul

 

[Paul Bestwick]

well.......coming up to three months since the nasty letter & it would appear that it was all bluff & hot air. (not another word since I counter nastied) Just as some of you suggested.

Cheers,

Paul

 

[Steve Saunders]

Hopefully that's the end of it Paul. Reading and re-reading your initial explanations, I get the feeling that the guy is in some financial difficulty and grasping at straws. The thing is he has blown your friendship now, if he had asked you to help him out in the first place I'm sure you would have done your best.

 

[Georg R. Baumann]

Just saw this the first time Paul. Strange story in deed, smells like desperation and stupidity. Makes one wonder why he did not approach you as a buddy, ah well, he blew it anyways and you have your peace back.