An apartement in Jerusalem

[Ben Rubinstein]

Hi!

Here is a Virtual Tour I shot yesterday. I had a huge amount of problems with it, small empty rooms with blank white walls are not condusive to stitching! Add to that the HDR was a bit of a problem, PTGUI will not accept that a set of images are HDR unless the shutter speeds are exactly the same throughout and with a maximum of +/-2 stops on a 5D, it's not easy. SNS-HDR is however an incredible program, haven't regretted it for a second!

I'm using Panotools Pro from Kolor here. It's nice to use, I just wish I could solve two big problems, a) the moire shimmering b) the color of the help screen at the beginning, you can change the colour but the icons and text are the same color always which is annoying!

I was having serious problems yesterday with the stitching, I just couldn't get 5 of them to do at all! I called up Valentin Arfire and he worked with me until midnight last night to get it working, the guy is my hero! He's also made some very useful suggestions for using my Sigma 8mm to the best advantage.

In any case have a look at what 1.5 million dollars buys you in central Jerusalem.

www.studio-beni.net/Town.html

 

[Asher Kelman]

Hi!

Here is a Virtual Tour I shot yesterday. I had a huge amount of problems with it, small empty rooms with blank white walls are not condusive to stitching! Add to that the HDR was a bit of a problem, PTGUI will not accept that a set of images are HDR unless the shutter speeds are exactly the same throughout and with a maximum of +/-2 stops on a 5D, it's not easy. SNS-HDR is however an incredible program, haven't regretted it for a second!

I'm using Panotools Pro from Kolor here. It's nice to use, I just wish I could solve two big problems, a) the moire shimmering b) the color of the help screen at the beginning, you can change the colour but the icons and text are the same color always which is annoying!

I was having serious problems yesterday with the stitching, I just couldn't get 5 of them to do at all! I called up Valentin Arfire and he worked with me until midnight last night to get it working, the guy is my hero! He's also made some very useful suggestions for using my Sigma 8mm to the best advantage.

In any case have a look at what 1.5 million dollars buys you in central Jerusalem.

www.studio-beni.net/Town.html

This is amazing effort and so commendable. Why did you change the viewer? I hope you and Valentin will write this up!

Asher

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

I had been using Autopano Tour Beta, I now have Panotours Pro, which is what it became post beta. It's nice and easy to use though in ways somewhat clunky.

I've posted a thread on the Kolor forum asking what to do about the help splash screen colour. The moire is a problem, it mostly disappears at full screen view but I'm not sure what to do about it. I had tried Pano2VR and it has the same issues.

 

[scott kirkpatrick]

1.5 Million in central Jerusalem

I can't muster too much envy for this place. Lots of room but the neighborhood doesn't look very elegant, with the large half-built abandoned building across the street. How did you shoot the panos without anything except the camera itself (seen by shadow or in the mirror)? Radio trigger, or self timer and duck?

I'm still working out the address from the information in the views and street scene.

scott

 

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

The moire is a problem, it mostly disappears at full screen view but I'm not sure what to do about it. I had tried Pano2VR and it has the same issues.

Hi Ben,

The problem is caused by the resizing/zooming algorithms in Flash. The only simple way of improving the situation is by using multiresolution Flash and proper downsampling techniques before converting the intermediate resolution tiles into Flash. Pano2VR can produce multiresolution files, and KRpano can do so as well.

One needs to use high quality resampling to produce the different resolution layers. Any resampling left to Flash will still create some moiré, so I'd say experiment with the number of intermediate resolution layers needed without creating too much bulk.

To avoid shimmering while rotating, uncheck the lower quality when moving settings. On slower computers that may lead to less smooth rotating though.

Cheers,
Bart

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

I can't muster too much envy for this place. Lots of room but the neighborhood doesn't look very elegant, with the large half-built abandoned building across the street. How did you shoot the panos without anything except the camera itself (seen by shadow or in the mirror)? Radio trigger, or self timer and duck?

I'm still working out the address from the information in the views and street scene.

scott

It's a building opposite the corner of King George and Keren Kayemet. To be honest it didn't impress me much either. The empty building is to be torn down and made into a hotel starting this year however the view aside, the apartment isn't that big, the bedrooms are certainly not very big, the general quality of the building work was 'typical' and I don't have to explain to you what that means! Apparently though the apartment is cheap relative to the area, across the street and behind it apartments are being sold for $10,000 a meter while this was some $2000 a meter less no doubt reflecting it's quality.

I shot that bathroom shot using a yongnou wireless remote, costs about $30 and is one of my most essential tools for working in Jerusalem in general, couldn't live without it! This was a rush job, I finished shooting at 6pm, was home an hour later and had to have the job ready for showing to a prospective buyer by 8am UK time. That explains the lack of a nadir patch and the tripod reflections and shadows everywhere. The outdoor HDR work is also a bit shoddy as I had to leave it to batch overnight (14 pano's all needed HDRing and SNS-HDR though good is slooooooow) and therefore didn't have time to touch them up. I'm going to tidy it up later, I shot this job as a freebie on condition I could use it as a portfolio page I'm trying to build to get me more work like this. The portfolio will be decidedly more 'finished' than this.

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

Hi Ben,

The problem is caused by the resizing/zooming algorithms in Flash. The only simple way of improving the situation is by using multiresolution Flash and proper downsampling techniques before converting the intermediate resolution tiles into Flash. Pano2VR can produce multiresolution files, and KRpano can do so as well.

One needs to use high quality resampling to produce the different resolution layers. Any resampling left to Flash will still create some moiré, so I'd say experiment with the number of intermediate resolution layers needed without creating too much bulk.

To avoid shimmering while rotating, uncheck the lower quality when moving settings. On slower computers that may lead to less smooth rotating though.

Cheers,
Bart

That all makes sense, I've been using highest quality when moving so that didn't help but I have to check if panotours allows multiresolution, I know that this wasn't, there was just one set of files for each pano. Thanks for letting me know what to look for!

*EDIT* they don't have an option for multiresolution, at least not one that I can find. Sigh...

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

I've been asking on the Kolor forum, speculation says that it's my shooting thats the problem. Can I send anyone a single pano and ask them to run it through KRPano or Pano2VR and see if it's the picture or the Kolor program?

www.studio-beni.net/1.jpg

 

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

*EDIT* they don't have an option for multiresolution, at least not one that I can find. Sigh...

Hi Ben,

Here's how in Pano2VR:
http://gardengnomesoftware.com/wiki/Pano2VR_-_Multiresolution

Also look at the Flash Output settings, in particular the Tile settings and Display settings.

In the Pano2Vr - Preferences you can set the Interpolation filter (for a trade-off between sharp and blurry, and your moiré issue!) and Aliasing settings.

Cheers,
Bart

 

[Bart_van_der_Wolf]

I've been asking on the Kolor forum, speculation says that it's my shooting thats the problem.

Frankly, that's nonsense.

Can I send anyone a single pano and ask them to run it through KRPano or Pano2VR and see if it's the picture or the Kolor program?[/url]

My PC with all the panostuff is currently out of commision, but have a look at the Pano2Vr parameters mentioned in my earlier message. I cannot do anything else than that either.
Solving it in KRPano requires a lot more fiddling with the settings for which I currently don't have the time, but perhaps someone sensible at the KRPano forum will yet add something that makes sense.

Cheers,
Bart

 

[Edward Bussa]

Looks like a lot of work for a freebie nonetheless! I would've thought enabling this kind of visual communication on such a valuable property would've gotten some kind of pay. What do these kinds of jobs usually go for?

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

The sale went through the next day, there was no need for it to be done but the realtor is a friend and he let me in to shoot it for portfolio!

Bart, I'll have to load up the pano2VR trial again and try it out, thanks!

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

Guy over on the Kolor forum said to try the files without sharpening, hey presto 70% of the moire is gone but the file still looks sharp. How much you wanna bet the flash program is running sharpening on the downsizing?

 

[fahim mohammed]

Ben, the vision, effort and tools you describe and use in your work are way way beyond my comprehension.

The results I can see and appreciate.

Best wishes.

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

Fahim, I'm flailing around in this stuff like a idiot kid thrown in a pool! Valentin and Bart are the real experts.

 

[Ben Rubinstein]

The next issue is the 'bellybutton' effect at the top of the image, at the zenith. Valentin thinks it's a NPP issue with the Sigma 8mm and is incredibly kindly going to borrow a friends NN5 to work out for himself what the real NPP is (I've been relying on the figures from the NN website) to see if he can solve this problem for me. The amount of kindness on this forum is unbelievable! First the lens itself which was donated and then all this assistance in using it.