Continuing Homage Journey

[Asher Kelman]

Here Marcia has a doll of newspaper and string.

Asher Kelman: Marcia with Infant

Canon 5DII, Northern Afternoon Light ​

Asher

 

[Jerome Marot]

I have more to post, but here's just a portrait in natural light.

Asher Kelman: Marcia: Waiting for Photography Setup!​

I missed this one. Quite different to the other ones, but the expression is priceless. The combination of the eyes and the hair is very powerful.

 

[Maggie Terlecki]

Asher,

There are 2 photos here. The first of Marcia waiting for the photo shoot to continue is beautiful. Her hair especially and she seems so relaxed and natural.

Marcia with Infant. I do like her position and find her hands very calm and relaxed. They don't seem posed at all. I can see using a doll to replace an infant, but am very curious about the doll being made out of newspaper and very thick string that appears to be rope. I guess this is my biggest hurdle, as I try to understand the significance of the appearance of the doll.

If the doll were a regular doll, I don't think I would give it a second thought, but here, there appears to be something else going on and I try to comprehend what it is.

So to start, I try to find a positive meaning. The doll is wrapped in newspaper and string, as a gift would have been in olden times before cutesy wrapping paper? Oh, but this doll is not wrapped in newspaper and string, she's made out of newspaper and string.

I then get some negative ideas, such as creepy voodoo and a child as a marionette, but neither of these ring true.

So, all I can be left with, is the woman and her need for nurturing. She has no child so creates one with stuff laying around. Ordinary newspaper and string from a drawer. Yes, she didn't have a child, but she has made herself one. Now, she is no longer restless and can sleep.

Have no idea what you intended, but this was my final conclusion.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Asher,

There are 2 photos here. The first of Marcia waiting for the photo shoot to continue is beautiful. Her hair especially and she seems so relaxed and natural.

Marcia with Infant. I do like her position and find her hands very calm and relaxed. They don't seem posed at all.

Thanks!

I can see using a doll to replace an infant, but am very curious about the doll being made out of newspaper and very thick string that appears to be rope. I guess this is my biggest hurdle, as I try to understand the significance of the appearance of the doll.

So, all I can be left with, is the woman and her need for nurturing. She has no child so creates one with stuff laying around. Ordinary newspaper and string from a drawer. Yes, she didn't have a child, but she has made herself one. Now, she is no longer restless and can sleep.

That's about it. It's actually a transformation from the picture with the violin. We try to make up for what we need as best we can to deal with our aches! Then we forget about what was really going on!

Like the nun that scratches her leg until, over the years, she has no idea why there's a rash and it's always red and scarred. All she knows is that it's part of her.

Asher

 

[Asher Kelman]

I want to thank everyone for feedback. It helps me understand how you read my pictures. I will be doing more work, hopefully soon and with film. So feel free to add your feelings and constructive thoughts. I don't know how the project will end up. I for sure will be influenced. That can't be helped! But I love to know your reactions, without any promise to take your advice with any more than a pinch of salt.

Asher

 

[Andy brown]

Hi Asher,

I do like how this series is evolving.
They're all beautiful shots and I've hesitated in offering any input because you clearly know what you're aiming for and are achieving it very nicely.

The concepts/lighting/mood/props and Marcia are all adding up to some gorgeous images.

The one opportunity I think could be explored more is with Marcia's lovely body.
She has an easy grace and sensuality to burn.
At the risk of objectifying her, I'd love to see you accentuate her hips a little more.
In the shot with the cello and the violin there's kind of a straight line formed between shoulder and hip.
In the shot with the oar there's more of the lovely feminine curve apparent.

Actually, having another look at the cello shot, there's a bit of a shadow from a crumpled sheet which interferes a bit with lines.

Anyway, hope this helps in some small way.
Cheers, andy

 

[Asher Kelman]

Thanks again Andy,

I appreciate you sticking your neck out to give an honest feedback. It's so helpful and encouraging.

Asher

 

[Michael_Stones]

Here Marcia has a doll of newspaper and string.

Asher Kelman: Marcia with Infant

Canon 5DII, Northern Afternoon Light ​

Asher

Good photo, Asher, but one that might benefit from more cues about Marcie's thoughts/feelings about the surrogate baby. Maggie commented as follows:

If the doll were a regular doll, I don't think I would give it a second thought, but here, there appears to be something else going on and I try to comprehend what it is.

So to start, I try to find a positive meaning. The doll is wrapped in newspaper and string, as a gift would have been in olden times before cutesy wrapping paper? Oh, but this doll is not wrapped in newspaper and string, she's made out of newspaper and string.

I then get some negative ideas, such as creepy voodoo and a child as a marionette, but neither of these ring true.

So, all I can be left with, is the woman and her need for nurturing. She has no child so creates one with stuff laying around. Ordinary newspaper and string from a drawer. Yes, she didn't have a child, but she has made herself one. Now, she is no longer restless and can sleep.

Have no idea what you intended, but this was my final conclusion.

I agree, but want to go further. All the images in this sequence have Marcie in a quiescent mode. In the latest, she has a baby surrogate rather than a musical instrument, but remains quiescent. So what turns her on? Were her relationships with the instruments a form of sublimation for the baby she wants? If so, shouldn't her pose with the near-baby convey passion though position and facial expression? Or is a baby something she desperately doesn't want? Then her pose expression should express negative feelings such as fear or disgust. As the photos are now, she comes across as someone without passion, as though none of the prop symbols mean much to her beyond safety and fondness. That's not her, I'm sure, but an outcome of your creative process.

But in the image below, Marcie has a bit of steel in her eyes, she looks slightly pissed-off. "Give me something to get excited about (or act excited about)", is what this photo suggests to me.

I have more to post, but here's just a portrait in natural light.

Asher Kelman: Marcia: Waiting for Photography Setup!​

I hope you like this one while I prepare more for posting!

Asher

What I'm getting at is that you're sitting on the fence in this series, Asher. Portraying love symbolically as St. Augustine depicted it in City of God, without lust, passion and pain. He allegedly was 72 years old when he finished that book, not a young man, whereas Marcie is a young woman. She is of an age when feelings, fears and passions define a life. I know from re-reading the start of this thread that you want to illustrate symbolically a "gentle bond" between two people (e.g., Lennon & Ono) but unless those people are indifferent to each other stronger emotions always come into play. Show us what they are. Hint at why they arise.

Cheers
Mike

 

[Doug Kerr]

Hi, Asher,

Vive la femmage!

Fabulous work, all of it.

Best regards,

Doug

 

[Michael_Stones]

Reading again what I wrote yesterday, I hope that nobody (and especially Asher) took that comment as meant other than constructively. I developed a thick skin and in my other life as a researcher in behavioural science and sometimes forget to tone things down in other contexts. For example, a recently submitted article of mine had about 4,000 words of text and elicited nearly half that amount in mainly harsh critiques from reviewers. I took that as a huge compliment, understanding that the article had significance for them, otherwise they would not have bothered to expend so much effort on it. What they were doing was the equivalent of coaching a sprinter currently running 100 m in 10.1 s to bring that performance up to 9.9 s standard. I modified that article, taking account of what I considered valid criticisms and arguing against those I thought invalid, with the final product much better for their input.

I wrote in an earlier post on this thread that I think Asher's photos are brilliant and much prefer them to Annie Leibowitz's image that inspired the series. That still holds true.

Cheers
Mike

 

[Asher Kelman]

Reading again what I wrote yesterday, I hope that nobody (and especially Asher) took that comment as meant other than constructively. I developed a thick skin and in my other life as a researcher in behavioural science and sometimes forget to tone things down in other contexts. For example, a recently submitted article of mine had about 4,000 words of text and elicited nearly half that amount in mainly harsh critiques from reviewers. I took that as a huge compliment, understanding that the article had significance for them, otherwise they would not have bothered to expend so much effort on it. What they were doing was the equivalent of coaching a sprinter currently running 100 m in 10.1 s to bring that performance up to 9.9 s standard. I modified that article, taking account of what I considered valid criticisms and arguing against those I thought invalid, with the final product much better for their input.

I wrote in an earlier post on this thread that I think Asher's photos are brilliant and much prefer them to Annie Leibowitz's image that inspired the series. That still holds true.

Mike,

The whole ethos of OPF is to aid folk on their own chosen path, sharing what they know, feel and think and have fun in the process! Other times, we can just say "Wow, wonderful picture!" and that's also nice and much appreciated, but not material to actually exploit and help us make our journeys! So thanks! You all give what I hoped for and more. It's not agreement we seek, but involvement. That's how we're strengthened and grow!

Asher

 

[Doug Kerr]

Hi, Mike,

For example, a recently submitted article of mine had about 4,000 words of text and elicited nearly half that amount in mainly harsh critiques from reviewers. I took that as a huge compliment, understanding that the article had significance for them, otherwise they would not have bothered to expend so much effort on it.

Well said.

It's of course best if they actually read it. I have some regular "opponents" (that's different from "critics", in the proper sense) who never do! (Not here on OPF - that is, not any longer on OPF).

Best regards,

Doug

 

[Asher Kelman]

Good photo, Asher, but one that might benefit from more cues about Marcie's thoughts/feelings about the surrogate baby. Maggie commented as follows:

I agree, but want to go further. All the images in this sequence have Marcie in a quiescent mode. In the latest, she has a baby surrogate rather than a musical instrument, but remains quiescent. So what turns her on? Were her relationships with the instruments a form of sublimation for the baby she wants? If so, shouldn't her pose with the near-baby convey passion though position and facial expression? Or is a baby something she desperately doesn't want? Then her pose expression should express negative feelings such as fear or disgust. As the photos are now, she comes across as someone without passion, as though none of the prop symbols mean much to her beyond safety and fondness. That's not her, I'm sure, but an outcome of your creative process.

But in the image below, Marcie has a bit of steel in her eyes, she looks slightly pissed-off. "Give me something to get excited about (or act excited about)", is what this photo suggests to me.



What I'm getting at is that you're sitting on the fence in this series, Asher. Portraying love symbolically as St. Augustine depicted it in City of God, without lust, passion and pain. He allegedly was 72 years old when he finished that book, not a young man, whereas Marcie is a young woman. She is of an age when feelings, fears and passions define a life. I know from re-reading the start of this thread that you want to illustrate symbolically a "gentle bond" between two people (e.g., Lennon & Ono) but unless those people are indifferent to each other stronger emotions always come into play. Show us what they are. Hint at why they arise.

Michael,

I came across your critical feedback, by chance and want to address your challenge. There's a gap in every scene in a drama between what the players planned or hoped for and what actually takes place. Similar gaps occur between the fantasies of the photographer and the expectations of the much, much younger female model. Sometimes the air does become passionate and it is something one has to face one way or another. It is a challenge to deal with these forces. The simplest way out for me is to focus more on beauty than eroticism.

It might be cowardice, but it's something to think about! It needs to be achieved without being personally involved, but during the shoot, a magnetic force field exists in which the work must be done.

Asher

 

[Asher Kelman]

I have more to post, but here's just a portrait in natural light.

Asher Kelman: Marcia: Waiting for Photography Setup!​

I hope you like this one while I prepare more for posting!

Asher

I accidentally wondered back here. At this point I had looked down from my ladder and wanted her hair spread generously, but failed to transfer my ideas well enough to Yeney, my assistant and chaperone. To my left was little grandson Lev staring up, open mouthed in wonder.

“What’s up, Lev?”

“Granpa Asher, that’s a real workerman’s ladder. So cool!”

I got my self down and asked Marcy if I could touch her her and arrange it a little differently.

This is the result and I was happy.

Lev was touching the exceptionally tall Yellow ladder totally engaged like itcwas a new friend!

Asher

 

[Asher Kelman]

I have repaired this 2012 thread as I found the two main pictures that had broken links.

I will endeavor to locate the third picture too!

Asher

 

[Asher Kelman]

Here are the early ones of the series

​

 

[Asher Kelman]

It’s a risk one takes inviting comments on one’s creative work.

My conviction is that all my decisions prior to posting images are part of my vision. With that imprimatur, all my choices are correct for this edition of the export of the ideas from my brain.

If others find beauty too, I am pleased.

Still all suggestions and ideas are measure of the cultural landscape and tend naturally speak more of the writers ideas for a similar artwork they might some day tackle themselves.

In that, I always glean nuggets of esthetic value and sometimes exceptional great advice which might find its way into future work by myself or someone else.

Asher

 

[Doug Kerr]

Asher,

Thank you for locating those shots. Marcia is of course exquisite, and those shots are brilliant.

Of course those who critique them may find many things that they suggest you might have done differently and (to them) better. Such is the nature of all endeavors. It is why red pencils exist. There is no issue of the "validity" of such comments. These photos are not asserted mathematical identities, our proofs of which might be shown to be flawed (the proofs of which might be flawed).

I am so pleased to be able to see again the shot of Marcia with the (endpin-less) cello.

Best regards,

Doug

 

[Doug Kerr]

Asher,

Oh, I see that now (perhaps earlier) Marcia: Waiting for Photography Setup! has been exhumed. A precious image!

Indeed, it is tempting to read into her expression."So just what is it you want, Mac?"

Best regards,

Doug

 

[Maggie Terlecki]

I remember these, although a few of them, not at all. But they are beautiful in that they are so relaxed and the items with her, to me, makes me feel like she dreaming of them which makes the images more magical and mysterious!

 

[Asher Kelman]

I remember these, although a few of them, not at all. But they are beautiful in that they are so relaxed and the items with her, to me, makes me feel like she dreaming of them which makes the images more magical and mysterious!

Thanks so much, Maggie for your thoughts. As Maris so rightly points out, photography of the undressed female covers two entirely different landscapes: creating tools for erotic stimulation and celebrating natures beauty.

In my practice then, I try to always cover genitals so as to steer the view as to my intent. Still, we have doggedly opinionated narrow views, that even breasts are too erotic to be viewed from solely a perspective of beauty.

When I was first in Africa it took a day of surprises of bare-chested women for me to realize that the over sexualization we imagine is an artificial construct. When our friend from Darwin, Australia uses the objectifying term, “tits” while posing as a protector of women, he’s actually at home with simple crude objectification of woman to their body parts.

It might be that in order to guard against such misreading of my photographs, I should also hide breasts! But then the complex organic curves from a woman and anterior neck to the center contour of a breast and to her adjacent axilla would be lost!

Asher

 

[Jerome Marot]

Of course those who critique them may find many things that they suggest you might have done differently and (to them) better. Such is the nature of all endeavors. It is why red pencils exist. There is no issue of the "validity" of such comments. These photos are not asserted mathematical identities, our proofs of which might be shown to be flawed (the proofs of which might be flawed).

When we create something, be it a photograph, a painting, a pice of music or a blog post about telephone exchanges, we should be grateful when other tell us how they perceive it. It is critique in the sense that other often tell us how they think they would have done it in our place. But the real information is to be derived from that critique. It tells us how the other person perceived the message. When, for example, a viewer tells us that he or she would have replaced the cello by something else, we learn that this particular viewer 1) noticed the cello and its relationship with the model, 2) had some knowledge of the visual similarity between violin and the female body and probably knew that photograph by Man Ray: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Violon_d'Ingres, 3) was not so convinced because the iconic portrait of John Lennon and Yoko Ono by Annie Leibowitz represented an heterosexual couple and not a woman embracing another female form, etc...

 

[Asher Kelman]

Thanks Doug , Maggie and Jérôme for your comments!

Of course, Jérôme, we benefit thus from hearing how, why and to what extent, others appreciate our art.

I gather the comments as treasures to use in various ways, sometimes to help better frame new work, so it doesn’t divert our gaze from what we treasure.

I do not create work to serve a market for existing ideas, but rather as a vehicle to express my own feelings and at times, disrupt boundaries that others see to our existence.

Asher

 

[Doug Kerr]

When we create something, be it a photograph, a painting, a pice of music or a blog post about telephone exchanges, we should be grateful when other tell us how they perceive it. It is critique in the sense that other often tell us how they think they would have done it in our place. But the real information is to be derived from that critique. It tells us how the other person perceived the message. When, for example, a viewer tells us that he or she would have replaced the cello by something else, we learn that this particular viewer 1) noticed the cello and its relationship with the model, 2) had some knowledge of the visual similarity between violin and the female body and probably knew that photograph by Man Ray: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Violon_d'Ingres, 3) was not so convinced because the iconic portrait of John Lennon and Yoko Ono by Annie Leibowitz represented an heterosexual couple and not a woman embracing another female form, etc...

Jérôme,

Well said, as usual.

Best regards,

Doug

 

[Asher Kelman]

[that person] …….

was not so convinced because the iconic portrait of John Lennon and Yoko Ono by Annie Leibowitz represented an heterosexual couple and not a woman embracing another female form, etc...

Jérôme,

Great points except in the last suggestion, I was very surprised that folk read sexual parameters between Marcia and La Larva in the first series of pictures I linked to in the opening of this thread.

That’s because in my mind true friendship is gender agnostic.

In fact in the original Leibowitz work, I never saw the couple as primarily as lovers but as devoted to each other.

In all my derived photographs, I was only interested in kinds of “attachment”, but not gender or sex.

Asher

 

[Asher Kelman]

Post for a series I enjoyed making!