Godox V860iii-S hardware failure: My journey to exchange speedlight, under mfgr 1 year warranty

[John Becich]

I believe I have a warranty claim against Godox,and I'd appreciate any duplication of failure, by readers of this thread. Also, some portraiture enthusiasts might find my predicament to be interesting.

I am invested in Sony APS-C camera bodies and Godox illumination components. Recently I acquired a much-celebrated-on-YouTube Sigma 56mm f/1.4 DC DN portrait lens that takes ultra-sharp pictures; it is built for my APS-C sensor size, and has an e-mount for Sony camera usage. High Speed Sync, meanwhile, remains an indispensible tool of modern creative photography. So does "reacting quickly" and that means I no longer shoot in full manual mode, as I had with film cameras. Enough background... I found a flawed combination and it is caused by a "failure to communicate" ... electronically... between differently-branded components. When I shoot in TTL-mode, HSS images are burned by full light output by the V860iii; when my Sony a6400 camera has the V860iii speedlight in the camera's hot shoe AND the Sigma 56mm lens in use. A Sony SEL18135 (zoomable) lens never had this problem, and still does not have this problem.

At first I suspected "inadequate design" in the Sigma 56mm lens, as it was bought only a few days ago, while my speedlight is 11 months into its duty atop my camera. Then I replaced the speedlight with a wireless transmitter (Godox X2T) in the hot shoe ... so as to activate any and all illuminators wirelessly. Sigma 56mm lens in use. No more burned images.

That means the X2T could, indeed, communicate with camera and lens, thereby instructing the illuminators (wirelessly) to throttle light output.

Hence, my belief that my Godox V860iii speedlight is failing to communicate with the other equipment components, when said speedlight is positioned in the hot shoe of the camera.

Thank you for any experiments or similar experiences.

 

[Asher Kelman]

I will check what I possess but although I have numerous Godox flashes, I only gave Canon and Fuji GFX lenses!

Asher

 

[Doug Kerr]

Hi, John,

Is this a correct synopsis of the problem you report:

With the Godox flash unit in the camera hot shoe (for the specific setup you describe), working with the flash in HSS mode, the flash illumination is seemingly not properly controlled by the TTL flash metering system but rather always operates "wide open"?

Thanks.

Best regards,

Doug

 

[John Becich]

Hi, John,

Is this a correct synopsis of the problem you report:

With the Godox flash unit in the camera hot shoe (for the specific setup you describe), working with the flash in HSS mode, the flash illumination is seemingly not properly controlled by the TTL flash metering system but rather always operates "wide open"?

Thanks.

Best regards,

Doug

Yes! Thank you for your interest.
I'm hoping someone might duplicate this error with his or her own equipment.
John

 

[Deleted member 55]

What firmware version is in the flash and camera and are they the latest versions?

Who did you purchase the flash from?

 

[John Becich]

What firmware version is in the flash and camera and are they the latest versions?

Who did you purchase the flash from?

Thank you for your interest. (I am a former writer of firmware; I am a retired electronics engineer.) Yes, the firmwares are up-to-date in the speedlight, the camera, and the new Sigma 56mm lens. Godox V860iii speedlight firmware 1.1; version is easily discovered by turning on the flash and pressing the "menu" button. By the way, I occasionally find firmware bugs in various consumer electronics items. I fear a "finger pointing" stand-off, between three different manufacturers, on this incompatibility.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Is it only the Sigma lens that is incompatible?

Asher

 

[John Becich]

I own only one Sigma lens; bought a few days ago. I've owned my Godox speedlight for 11 months. I own a legacy Zeiss portrait lens that I have "adaptered" to the same camera, and it UTTERLY fails HSS the same way as does the Sigma 56mm lens: as if not communicating so as to attenuate light output in the speedlight. Because that Zeiss lens has no electronic terminals, and no electronics whatsoever.
Be reminded, this Sigma-with-Godox (utter) failure occurs only if the V860iii is working as an ON CAMERA flasher. I call that failure a "qualitative failure" because there's nothing to criticize closely. When I test the V860iii OFF-CAMERA, by means of X2T transmitter in the hot shoe of the camera, HSS passes qualitatively; i.e., at least crudely.

I repeated the same experiment with a Sony a6000 camera body, my one and only V860iii, and the Sigma 56mm lens. Same HSS blowout error.

 

[John Becich]

I have made considerable strides in finding the culprit, and it is almost certainly my V860iii speedlight. I ordered a second one which will arrive within a week, and I'll verify my results by substitution method; i.e., "bad" speedlight vs. "new" speedlight. If the new speedlight fails similarly, then it's a design problem. If the new speedlight solves the problem, then I have a defective single unit in my 11-month-old V860iii.
See pictures below.
I have succeeded in achieving HSS images, using the Sony a6400 camera paired with the Sigma 56mm lens. Failure of HSS occurs if and only if (IFF) the distance calculation display at the speedlight fails. The mere intermittent failure of said display has been known to me for almost my entire ownership period, and I considered it a nuisance. Only recently I began shooting HSS and then I bought the Sigma lens, and now the "mere nuisance" seems to be a serious problem.

If anyone can inspect his or her V860iii, for consistency in distance display (not accuracy of distance; just whether or not the distance bar shows consistently) I would appreciate that feedback.

 

[John Becich]

Is it only the Sigma lens that is incompatible?

Asher

By now, I have produced occasional HSS error using Sony SEL18135 lens. Sigma lens not necessary to produce error, but error occurs more easily when Sigma lens is in use.
The correlation of "failed distance display" on my V860iii speedlight, to HSS overexposure, is 100%.
So how does that "display" error come and go? It's dependent on ambient light. Let's say the display works better in bright ambient conditions, than in dim ambient conditions. When I found the boundary between those two conditions, I produced the images of red leaves, posted on July 3 at 4:41PM.

 

[John Becich]

The date is Sunday, July 9, and I have new developments in the case of "HSS, Distance Display Fault, and Godox V860iii speedlight." In summary: I sent the bad speedlight back under warranty protection. In the meanwhile, I've bought another, which works nicely.

I finally heard from the retailer, which was tasked with replacing my defective speedlight by the manufacturer, Godox. I have been in reasonably good contact with both; Godox (in Shenzhen) is easy to reach at servicesupport@godox.com.

Not waiting for the replacement, and since I want two speedlights anyway, I bought another. Testing commenced immediately and it passes HSS with the Sigma 56mm lens. Communication is obvious, between lens and speedlight, through the camera, because the flash is properly attenuated to hit my face just right. More satisfying still is that the distance calculator display works perfectly, in dark or daylight conditions.

At this point in time, which is early in my testing cycle, I have observed a peculiarity in HSS operation, TTL mode. It matters not whether I bias the flash -2, 0, or +2 for brightness. I will test in non-HSS mode and expect to see dramatic bias effects. Stay with me, and I suggest you test this for yourself. I use finger gestures to indicate "- 2" and "+ 2" for indelible recordation. The "properties" of digital photographs speak to camera exposure compensation (deliberate), not deliberate flash bias.

 

[John Becich]

Failure of DELIBERATE FLASH BIAS failed to repeat. I don't know why failure occurred previously. Ho hum that's good news with an asterisk So my new Godox V860iii-S (f/w version 1.1) is passing all my tests.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Congratulations on have the focus, determination and intelligence to sort out the odd behavior of your original Godox flash unit.

Do you use one off the camera as a slave or a different A,B,DC or D group?

Asher

 

[Jerome Marot]

since Godox refuses to publish a GUIDE NUMBER CHART,

Making your own guide number chart is not difficult. You only need one correctly exposed picture and a calculator...

 

[John Becich]

Congratulations on have the focus, determination and intelligence to sort out the odd behavior of your original Godox flash unit.

Do you use one off the camera as a slave or a different A,B,DC or D group?

Asher

The newly-bought V860iii continues to perform AS EXPECTED. No surprises That means, everything works. To answer your question, I have not yet tested this particular item as a slave, yet. But I have used it as an ON CAMERA flash and as a transmitter to two other Godox slave items, and this arrangement works flawlessly. The chances of this new flash working as a slave, to my X2T on-camera transmitter, are very high, although it will be a few days before I can get around to testing that exact arrangement; hence my early reply. To elaborate further, I now INSIST on a multi-flash (with chandelier turned almost off) set up, with a Sony APS-C (a6000 series) camera on a high tripod, for memorable pictures around a dinner table. Recently (July 9) I succeeded at this very effort, with a group of a dozen people, all impatient as hell except for me. I used a tiny lens aperture and 25mm manual lens to get EVERYONE in the picture and IN SHARP FOCUS, and the flashes all pumped light to the max. (My wife complained ) But that's how I achieved even lighting, good white balance, and of course I got INTO THE PICTURE too. One remote (slave) flash was a Flashpoint AD200 (fully compatible with Godox econsystem) and the other flash was an ancient Vivitar 5200 that was mounted on a modern X1R-S "receiver." Yes, even my old flash was useful, for some backlighting. But that old flash re-charged slowly and didn't fire for all my snaps. I look forward to receiving my "replacement" V860iii to use either ON CAMERA; or OFF CAMERA as back lighting in banquet situations.

On July 10, I took the new V860iii to the waterfront, where I ride my bike frequently. This was the first use of this flash, "in the field," and it performed HSS flash flawlessly. What a joy to look at the distance calculator display and to have it perform as it should.

I will add that, since Godox refuses to publish a GUIDE NUMBER CHART, using this V860iii the OLD FASHIONED WAY is impossible, except by trial and error and no engineer or part-time photographer wants to do that. Trial and error makes for goof ups and missed opportunities. I am a reasonably slow shooter who likes to capture an occasional precious moment, or perhaps a squirrel in a tree who poses for a fleeting moment. I need that distance calculator, especially if I am shooting the OLD FASHIONED WAY (manual mode camera etc) with a modern flash.

My Vivitar 5600 remains workable. It has TWO advantages over a modern flash. The first advantage is that it is straightforward to set up manually. The flash head, for example, is manually adjustable so that the photographer might match his/her light beam to the "cone" of exposure; i.e., to the foc
al length of the lens in use. Meanwhile, the V860iii requires battery power and tinkering with back panel dials and buttons for everything.



The other advantage of the ancient (1970s) Vivitar 5600 is that it has a thyristor bounce design, that works independently of the camera; i.e., this is a shorter (less exact) feedback loop, than TTL (Through The Lens) feedback loop. (Bigger loops are generally better than feedback topologies that do not encompass the entire function of an "amplifier aka plant" with "feedback." (aka "a" and "f" to an engineer). But that good old thyristor was good enough most of the time. More importantly, it allowed measured light outputs when using fully-manual camera with manual lens. No TTL flash can do that. When I use a manual ("dumb") lens with my Sony a6400 camera, the Godox V860iii has not feedback pathway intact. So the shooter must used "M" mode on the flash, and dial down the light amount, tediously. How to set that light output exactly will ultimately rely on the distance calculator, I believe.



Perhaps my future contribution to this sub-forum ("Godox only") will include some demonstrations of manually shooting, with legacy ("dumb") lenses.

Recent photo to follow. It shows myself in a pith helmet, which is my bike helmet chosen to keep SoCal sun out of my eyes and off the back of my neck. The point here is that HSS succeeded. 😁

Making your own guide number chart is not difficult. You only need one correctly exposed picture and a calculator...

Thank you for this reply. I will look into this! I need a chart that spans variables of aperture, ISO, lens focal length in meters, range in meters. I'll refer to the Nikon Flash Guide (again) for inspiration.

 

[Jerome Marot]

Thank you for this reply. I will look into this! I need a chart that spans variables of aperture, ISO, lens focal length in meters, range in meters. I'll refer to the Nikon Flash Guide (again) for inspiration.

It is easy, really. Guide numbers are the product of only two factors as follows: Guide number = f-number × distance

This simple inverse relationship holds true because the brightness of a flash declines with the square of the distance, but the amount of light admitted through an aperture decreases with the square of the f-number. Accordingly a guide number can be factored to a small f‑number times a long distance just as readily as a large f‑number times a short distance.

So basically you take pictures at a fixed distance, for example 2 meters and vary the aperture. You check which picture is correctly exposed and you have your guide number.

Then, guide numbers change as the square root of the difference in ISO sensitivity. So, if you have the guide number for ISO 100, the one for ISO 200 is 1.4 times more and the one for ISO 400 is two times more.

Guide numbers are independent of focal length. They will depend on the zoom setting on a flash head if your flash has one.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Jérôme,

Succinct and so helpful reminding us of how basic guide numbers can be discovered!

🙏

Asher

 

[John Becich]

Follow up: Replacement V860iii arrived in good order on July 22. So turn-around took 15 days, from the date I shipped out my defective item. The new item performs splendidly, at least to the extent I've tested it after two sessions of use; i.e., as a TTL flash atop a Sony a6000-series camera. Importantly, the speedlight's back panel distance display works as expected, and identically to the performance of a second new V860iii that I recently bought. High speed sync on both V860iii works well.


Clearly, my original V860iii was defective and I'm glad I was able to exchange it.



Unlike a Shenzhen surveillance camera manufacturer (Anpviz), which sent me replacement cameras directly from China, Godox relies on its retailer (which can be a tiny business) to negotiate with the end user when Godox goods fail under manufacturer's warranty. The bottom line? Godox made good on its 1 year promise! It was a hassle getting through to that tiny retailer, via Amazon messaging, and the exchange process would have been "more interesting" if the retailer had gone out of business. Again, I requested an exchange after 11 1/2 months of ownership, even though I recognized a "nuisance failure" after only 3 months of light-duty usage. The failure was likely in the wiper and slip ring assembly at the pivot joint of the speedlight; pure hardware failure, not fixable with firmware improvement as I suspected after 3 months of ownership.

I am an electronics engineer quite familiar with spotting hardware and firmware failures. China has only one time zone, and I suspect that junior engineers write firmware (which can be fixed later, like Microsoft software so often was "fixed later" in the 1990s). Hardware and optics go to customers with a much higher level of refinement. Surveillance electronics from Shenzhen often perform "curiously" after daylight savings time takes effect in the USA. Speedlights don't have a real time clock, to my knowledge, but surveillance cameras do. I'm never surprised to see buggy firmware and the most common errors are related to real time clock.

My investment in the Godox lighting ecosystem remains very favorable.

 

[Asher Kelman]

I might suggest that for any new Godox cameras, consider the AD 400 or other batter powered flashes. Also get the AC adapter.

This way one can take the lights to an outside shoot at a moments notice without worrying about power.

A warning: don’t let batteries run down totally or they may have to be forced to recharge.

Asher

 

[Deleted member 55]

Good to hear about the quick turnaround!

I had a Crucial 4TB SSD that failed in the first 6 months of a multi year warranty and it took 2 months to get it replaced!

Just today I had another of their SSD’s fail!

I dread the daily fight with them to get it replaced!

I fear that if I had not called them every day I would not have gotten a replacement drive!

 

[Deleted member 55]

Try pressing the set button and holding it it down for a few seconds.

Turn the unit off then while pressing the set button turn it on.

After reading the godox manual I remembered that Godox has some hidden commands for there equipment.

OOPS WRONG THREAD!

 

[Asher Kelman]

Try pressing the set button and holding it it down for a few seconds.

Turn the unit off then while pressing the set button turn it on.

After reading the godox manual I remembered that Godox has some hidden commands for there equipment.

That does what?

A factory reset??