New processing software for me - features

[Cem_Usakligil]

I dont believe the training is free. From what I understand is that it is part of their Subscription model



They offer both subscription based and one time purchase. I opted for the one times purchase as I dont need the training or the syncing and I dont want to pay for a subscription.

Like most software now (topaz, exposure, etc) there is an upgrade price with major upgrades (often yearly) if you want to have the new latest features (I suspect the new auto selection and sharpen ai will only be available in the next major version, requiring me to pay for the upgrade if I want those features) —- however the current version you have will always function and so you own it. For me, its quite different than PS or LR because you dont have an option to use their software at all unless you perpetually pay.




I currently am using an attached SSD drive for the cache files and data backup. I only keep software applications on my internal hard drive.

I have paid the yearly "major" upgrade fees so far, around 80 Euro each. However, for the newest version which includes masking and tack sharp, they are asking for an incredible 188 Euro right now, which is a special price they say. I am definitely not going to upgrade at that price level. THey must have gone crazy if they think that normal users will pay for this.

 

[Robert Watcher]

I wasnt aware that the major upgrade was available yet and have never seen any pricing for it. All I have been able to find is the Announcements and News details on their website - https://www.on1.com/blog/category/announcements/ and n their Facebook page where as of a couple of days ago they havent announced a release date yet - @on1photo

I have the latest Version 2022.5, but didn’t purchase the Plus with plugins and membership, etc that are listed in your attachment pic. I have no need for any of that stuff so am expecting a more nominal fee for the next release with sharpen and smart masking - if I decide to upgrade at this time / or not. Have to wait and see.

At least I own what I have and it suits my needs well. Still finding out all the features that I might benefit from. Of course I am only looking for one application that will provide me with all I need. Being that I use Affinity Photo, that provides for my more extensive editing and faster functionality like Inpainting tools. It is so easy to export from ON1 to Affinity and save back to the same folder to continue working in ON1.

Here is the upgrade price to the latest 2022.5 if one has an older version.:

 

[Cem_Usakligil]

I wasnt aware that the major upgrade was available yet. I have the latest Version 2022.5, but didn’t purchase all the plugins, subscriptions, cloud storage, extra activations, etc that are listed in your attachment pic. I have no need for any of that stuff so am expecting a more nominal fee for the next release with sharpen and smart masking - if I decide to upgrade at this time / or not. Have to wait and see. At least I own what I have and it suits my needs well. Still finding out all the features that I might benefit from. Of course I am only looking for one application that will provide me with all I need. Being that I use Affinity Photo, that provides for my more extensive editing and faster functionality like Inpainting tools. It is so easy to export from ON1 to Affinity and save back to the same folder to continue working in ON1.

The new major upgrade isn't available yet, these are the early bird prices, hahaha. And they do not yet offer an upgrade price for the ON1 Photo RAW only without the plugings. That's why I have given those prices. Let's wait and see when they will announce the price for that upgrade only.

 

[Robert Watcher]

How did you get that early bird price? I guess I don’t have the right connections. LOL.

 

[Robert Watcher]

ON TOP OF THE WORLD, ABOVE THE CLOUDS

Poas Volcano on a clear day —- stunningly beautiful. (Costa Rica)

I’m loving the image processing control that on1 Photo Raw provides me - extensive masking, and adjustment layers for full control. (second shot is without processing)

 

[Asher Kelman]

Robert,

Would you end up with a harder path to this superb result with Photoshop if there was no problem with the fees?

 

[Asher Kelman]

I have taken a dislike to both Lightroom and On1 for the complex way they have to import images. Also On1 decides that filesi never intended need to be imported.

Instead I am using ACDSee to catalog the images. It’s simpler and obedient like Iview Media Pro and it’s progeny.

I do wonder, though if there are features in On1 that might be far superior to those in Photoshop.

It certainly is a program with some of the best PR!

Asher

 

[Asher Kelman]

ON TOP OF THE WORLD, ABOVE THE CLOUDS

Poas Volcano on a clear day —- stunningly beautiful. (Costa Rica)

I’m loving the image processing control that on1 Photo Raw provides me - extensive masking, and adjustment layers for full control. (second shot is without processing)

View attachment 9879



View attachment 9880​

How hard to get this result in Photoshop?

Asher

 

[Robert Watcher]

How hard to get this result in Photoshop?

Asher

Thanks Asher. Not hard at all. The same result can be had with any image editing application as far as I am concerned. Photoshop is the most powerful software going. I’m just enjoying the process of being able to accomplish it in on1.

What on1 Photo Raw is providing me, is the ability to do almost everything that I need to accomplish, from organizing to complex masking on different layers - all without leaving the application, and all non-destructively. It isn’t necessarily the fastest or best at handling everything, but does everything well. So it isn’t primarily about the fees for me.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Thanks Asher. Not hard at all. The same result can be had with any image editing application as far as I am concerned. Photoshop is the most powerful software going. I’m just enjoying the process of being able to accomplish it in on1.

What on1 Photo Raw is providing me, is the ability to do almost everything that I need to accomplish, from organizing to complex masking on different layers - all without leaving the application, and all non-destructively. It isn’t necessarily the fastest or best at handling everything, but does everything well. So it isn’t primarily about the fees for me.

I actually followed your encouraging experience with On1 principally for organizing catalogs. However, that so non/intuitive for me and I haven't gotten comfortable with it. I am so used to the simplicity of Media Pro, (“drag and drop on or out!”, that I haven’t been able to escape immense frustration at On1 or Lightroom!!!

I need electric shock or some youth serum as I ask, “How is it that Robert enjoys it but I don’t?”

Asher

 

[Robert Watcher]

I am so pleased to have received an email from on1 this morning. Looks like I will get the new sharpen and masking features at no additional cost. That is a relief being that I just purchased not long ago.

“We're excited to announce ON1 Photo RAW version 2023 will be available this October! As someone who purchased Photo RAW 2022 recently, you're eligible for a free upgrade to version 2023. You will receive instructions on how to claim your free upgrade when it's available in October. See the mind-blowing new features in version 2023 including Super Select AI, Mask AI, Adaptive Presets, Tack Sharp AI, and more.”

 

[Cem_Usakligil]

Coming back to the price of an upgrade this time around, it is apparently 101 Euro!!!! They are really out of their mind to ask for this kind of upgrade price. I won't be upgrading any longer.

 

[Robert Watcher]

I actually followed your encouraging experience with On1 principally for organizing catalogs. However, that so non/intuitive for me and I haven't gotten comfortable with it. I am so used to the simplicity of Media Pro, (“drag and drop on or out!”, that I haven’t been able to escape immense frustration at On1 or Lightroom!!!

I need electric shock or some youth serum as I ask, “How is it that Robert enjoys it but I don’t?”

Asher

Hey that is why different companies maintain their loyalty. No product provides everything for everyone. Lots of photographers complain about Olympus camera menus or focusing or video capabilities or the fact that it has a 4/3 size sensor. I have no issues with any of those features on my Olympus cameras and speak favourably about the incredible features it has that I make use of that will keep me using Olympus gear ahead of any other. And these are features that for years I have made a living from as a professional photographer - even though my gear has been classified as not professional. LOL

I am grateful when the software developers provide full trial versions that I can verify that I can benefit from them - before I purchase. Your workflow is probably quite different from mine Asher.

I’m sure that Media Pro is a wonderful Media Asset Manager. And if that is a priority, then that is your product. I used to detest using Bridge in the old days before Lightroom - not because it didnt do the intended job - but once I caught on to Lightroom back in about 2007, it gave me the organizing functionality as well as image processing abilities that I needed, all in one application.

So that is more what I am looking for in on1 Photo Raw and have found. But on both counts (organizing and processing) I find more value than Lightroom. I’ve never compared it to the abilities of Photoshop or for that matter Affinity Photo. I still export to Affinity Photo on ocassions (such as the power lines last night) because it is superior and faster to do content aware fixes. on1 has that functionality, and if I didnt have Affinity, I would use it and be satisfied. But its not nearly as good as Affinity or PS

I also like the fact that if I dont feel like forking out for a newer version at any given time, I can still get my work done and be totally content with the results. That is how I used to view Photoshop and even Lightroom when I purchased a real application that I could keep on my computers and use for years because I didnt feel like coming up with hundreds of dollars for an upgrade that may only marginally affect my productivity or ability. I was really ticked when I made a choice to upgrade to the latest Lightroom version and right after paying $149, found out they were going to a subscription model and there would be no further updates or bug fixes to what I had. I used that version as long as I could, then needed to concede to the subscription for a couple of years until I got my new MacBook M1 that could handle the newer softwares (my old base model MacBook Air didn’t qualify)

So that is my logic Asher. I’m just sharing my experience, not trying to convince anyone of my choices.

 

[Asher Kelman]

It’s me that's at fault. It’s like learning to use a cross bow and being given a British long bow. One’s reflexes and intuition can be discordant!

Media Pro, unfortunately won’t work on modern Macs!

Ashef

 

[Robert Watcher]

Some of features that I am really looking forward to in the new 2023 Update coming out in October - and will definitely use to speed up my workflow.

Super Select AI and Mask AI - where all sections of a picture will have an auto generated mask to apply Filters or Adjustments to.

Content Aware Crop will be fantastic - I always am using Inpainting tools (Content Aware) to extend areas of my image that are blank after a Transform or Panoramic Stitch. If this does a decent job automatically, I will be very pleased

Tack Sharp AI will mean that I dont have to leave my application to apply smart sharpening (plus no need to pay for the regular update of my Topaz Sharpen plugin) - plus the sharpening like the built in No Noise AI are non destructive and can have settings altered at any time

Keyword AI - now this may be really cool being I never bother Keywording my image files - since posting on the VERO app, I have been loving the auto generated keyword hashtags that are created based on the image content (similar with Google Photo content recognition) so that I dont have to come up with my own words. The beauty is that I dont have to apply them to an image to be useful - the content generated Keywords will be available for searching my Catalogue. To be able to enter “sunsets” as an example in the Search bar and have all thumbnails of sunsets from all years in my Catalog display without my entering having enters Keywords into the file Meta data, would be great I’m thinking.

If these features work as I expect they will do based on my experience with what is already there in on1 2022.5, I am considering this application to be very good value for my needs. I am happy with what is already available LOL.

——

 

[Robert Watcher]

The picture of the volcano above required about 10 mask layers to get the result I wanted from different parts of the scene. It will be interesting to see how granular the auto generated mask selections will be with these new AI Masking features.

 

[Cem_Usakligil]

Some of features that I am really looking forward to in the new 2023 Update coming out in October - and will definitely use to speed up my workflow.

Super Select AI and Mask AI - where all sections of a picture will have an auto generated mask to apply Filters or Adjustments to.

Content Aware Crop will be fantastic - I always am using Inpainting tools (Content Aware) to extend areas of my image that are blank after a Transform or Panoramic Stitch. If this does a decent job automatically, I will be very pleased

Tack Sharp AI will mean that I dont have to leave my application to apply smart sharpening (plus no need to pay for the regular update of my Topaz Sharpen plugin) - plus the sharpening like the built in No Noise AI are non destructive and can have settings altered at any time

Keyword AI - now this may be really cool being I never bother Keywording my image files - since posting on the VERO app, I have been loving the auto generated keyword hashtags that are created based on the image content (similar with Google Photo content recognition) so that I dont have to come up with my own words. The beauty is that I dont have to apply them to an image to be useful - the content generated Keywords will be available for searching my Catalogue. To be able to enter “sunsets” as an example in the Search bar and have all thumbnails of sunsets from all years in my Catalog display without my entering having enters Keywords into the file Meta data, would be great I’m thinking.

If these features work as I expect they will do based on my experience with what is already there in on1 2022.5, I am considering this application to be very good value for my needs. I am happy with what is already available LOL.

——

The keyword AI is the one I'm interested in, although I am not sure about the aspect of privacy. Are my photos scanned on-line and what is done with the info gathered?

 

[Robert Watcher]

I guess that is more a concern if one uses the subscription model

 

[Robert Watcher]

I currently am only using one 27” monitor on my computer, but I was very pleased to find out the other day that on1 has a setting called Dual Mode that separates the browsing module from the editing module. Even on my single monitor, this really facilitates clicking between files in by Album of final selection files for this job. Up until now, I have only had the option of clicking between the Browse and Edit buttons to move between the two interfaces. It was a little slow and tedious.

 

[Asher Kelman]

This is a fabulous feature!

I hope other software can do the same!

Asher

 

[Robert Watcher]

I love my LG 4K monitor and never really had a need for second monitor. As well, I didn’t want to fill my smaller already fully utilized desk space with an extra full size monitor.
Two realities changed my decision this week - - - first is that my wife and I are taking off for 10 days, and I realized how useful a portable monitor could be for allowing me to take my MacMini M1 with me for a compact working setup - as well as my finding out about the Dual Mode feature in my on1 Photo Raw software that allows me to manage all of my files in a separate space (on a separate monitor) while making use of my full high resolution display for editing images.

I ordered the InnoView 15.8” 1080p monitor from Amazon yesterday, and was very excited to be using it today for the extra real estate while editing images and coding. I love it sitting on my desktop in Portrait orientation, as well as the portability knowing that I can easily move it out of the way or simple unplug it and set it aside. Next week I will find out how it works out in my backpack along with my macmini, Sandisk SSD drive and Bluetooth keyboard and mouse.

My wife plans on plugging her new iPad mini in via usb-C for watching her shows on a little larger a screen while travelling.

I really wasn’t expecting these portable monitors to be as good as they are.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Wonderful advances.

I used your reports on the amazing Mac mini to go for an M1x but a MacBook Pro 17”.

I now want that LG display! Which is it and how does it hook up?

I have on1 I just need to get myself used to the loading of files paradigm!

Or perhaps ACDSee has the two monitor capability!

Now you report it, it’s a must, like having AF!!

Asher

 

[Robert Watcher]

So my monitor decision was not to purchase the “best” expensive one available - - - but with a lot of research I determined that this LG would provide the best reasonably priced monitor for image and video editing for my purposes. In reality the price I paid of around $400 CAD 2 years ago through Newegg, was at the very top of my budget, but has been worth every penny to me. This was a two year old choice though, perhaps there are better ones to be made now - as well, while I was thinking it was a 30” monitor, it is a 27” - but that is more than satisfactory for my workspace.

I found the Amazon.com listing for the model I have. It looks like there is a $100 saving at $250 USD. For Amazon Canada, it has the same $100 saving for a price of $350 CAD instead of $450 - but also an additional $26 shipping fee.

Amazon LG 27UL500-W 4K monitor

​

Here is a pic of the back setup - I purchased a single arm monitor stand with VESA mount to attach to the edge of my desk, instead of using the included desktop stand. I have it connected by HDMI, but it can be run by DisplayPort as well.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Fabulous! Amazing how LG has made such monitors at really low prices!

Thanks for sharing!

Asher

 

[Robert Watcher]

So happy that I can use my MacMini M1 while traveling (much thanks to the Portable Monitor I purchased the other day). A picture of my setup on the road in the kitchen of the place that we are staying for the next two weeks. I don’t have to sacrifice my ability to handle some heavy coding projects that require VSC and an Apache Server — - - as well as being able to spend time organizing files on my hard drives.

 

[Pao Dolina]

Incredible image!

 

[Robert Watcher]

On1 Photo Raw 2023 was released today. Fortunately I was able to get a free upgrade as I made my purchase of the on1 software in August of this year.

Some of the new features are putting on1 photo raw over the top as my main photo editing and organizing software. I only downloaded and installed the new 2023 version with new AI features, an hour ago. I was very pleased pleased to find that the AI selection and live preview abilities - did not slow down or become laggy on my macmini M1.


I found the AI selection tools very intuitive, and easy to use. These features alone are going to speed up my creative process on my images dramatically.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Excellent Robert!

I must try it too!

Asher

 

[Cem_Usakligil]

On1 Photo Raw 2023 was released today. Fortunately I was able to get a free upgrade as I made my purchase of the on1 software in August of this year.

Some of the new features are putting on1 photo raw over the top as my main photo editing and organizing software. I only downloaded and installed the new 2023 version with new AI features, an hour ago. I was very pleased pleased to find that the AI selection and live preview abilities - did not slow down or become laggy on my macmini M1.


I found the AI selection tools very intuitive, and easy to use. These features alone are going to speed up my creative process on my images dramatically.





View attachment 10013

I am happy to hear that you are happy Robert. I had succumbed to the marketing pressure of getting an early order discount and ordered the 2023 version back in September despite the fact that I was not planning to do so. After getting the end product and playing with it, I must say I was disappointed. Firstly, I find the selections made by Super Select tool, as you have shown above, to be rather imprecise. As you can see in your example there are a lot of halos. And your example is one of the better ones I should say. In my case, many of my photos could not be selected with any precision. Secondly, I was charmed by the possibility of automated keywording, that the program would be able to generate keywords using an AI algorithm. Well, it does so to some extent but AI's object recognition is very poor and the keywords suggested are not good enough or sometimes irrelevant. Last, but not least, the AI functions such as the noise reduction and the sharpening do not yet work with my Nvidia RTX 2070 Super graphics card. I have to wait for a new version of the driver in the hope that somebody will fix it somewhen. So I gave the product back to ON1 and got my money back. I should say that I am sad since I really wanted it to work as advertised.

Now on the other hand, today the new Photoshop ACR and LR have been released with the same functionality as the Super Select of ON1. And they do a really better job at selecting. So I am happy eventually.

 

[Asher Kelman]

Cem,

You are using LR classic? I find the interface so confusing as I am so used to Phase One Media Pro.

I also didn’t fit in with On1 either.

I keep a 2014 Mac Pro going ONLY FOR The Media Pro Catalogs!

I am glad the new features are in PS.

What do I miss by using PS and not LR?

Asher