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No image, just outrage

Rachel Foster

New member
I attempted to post a link on Facebook to a nonracist, nonsexist, nonhomophobic Passover Haggadah. Facebook blocked the link saying "Some content in this message has been reported as abusive by Facebook users." You know what? I don't care if someone finds it offensive. It does NOT violate common standards of decency. I AM OUTRAGED!

By the way, if you click the link it goes to auto - download.
 

Ben Rubinstein

pro member
I would agree with them. There is a whole heck of a lot of abuse thrown at ancient Eygyptians in the Passover Hagadda! Not that they didn't deserve it.. ;-)
 

Rachel Foster

New member
Ben, this Haggadah doesn't talk about Egypt. I think that might be part of why it's considered "offensive."

A quote: "The word Mitzrayim
Throughout the Haggadah, we have chosen the term ‘Mitzrayim’, instead of ‘Egypt’. Mitzrayim comes from the root Tzar, meaning narrow or constricted. It can refer to the geography of the Nile valley, but also to a metaphorical state of confinement. The Passover story is also the story of the birth of the Jewish people, and ‘mitzrayim’ is the narrow passage we moved through. Leaving ‘mitzrayim’ also means freeing ourselves from narrow-mindedness and oppression. And in this time of intense anti-Arab racism, we are intentionally differentiating between the “bad guys” in this story and any contemporary Arab places or people."

John, Passover is observed oftentimes with a dinner (called a Seder). There is a certain ceremonial aspect to it, including the retelling of the Exodus story. A book called a Haggadah is used. There are numerous versions of Haggadot, from orthodox to reconstructionist. We choose to use one that is on the very liberal end of the continuum. I fully support the use of orthodox and conservative Haggadot. It's a personal choice families make. My beef is that Facebook blocked the link to the one we chose when I tried to post it.

It's not the Haggadah that is the issue. It's summarily blocking religious choice and expression. This is not something that is culturally outside the realm of acceptable. It does not advocate violence or other unacceptable practices. My beef is refusal to permit freedom of religious expression.
 

Rachel Foster

New member
Even more frustrating is that there seems to be no way to contact the FB administration. My only solution of sorts has been to form a protest group and ask people to join and report the group itself as offensive. I realize FB might block my membership, but it matters to me. I'm disappointed at how few people care to support my fight, though.
 

Rachel Foster

New member
Good idea. You mean on Facebook?

The Haggadah is the book one uses during the Passover dinner. I am having difficulty finding a comparison Christians would be familiar with.

I hope this is open to everyone to see (I tried to make the privacy settings so its freely accessible). This is the 'offensive' Haggadah. I realize it may well offend some; however it is not outside of culturally acceptable standards.
 

Rachel Foster

New member
Darn, seems you have to belong to Facebook to see it. I don't want to copy it here since I know it may upset some OPF members.

OK, I posted it on my blog. IF anyone wants to see it, it is available here
 
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Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Alan,

The Haggada is "the story". It tells of the ancient hebrews stettlement in Pharaohic Egypt, a lost civilization that believed in an afterlife wherein the leader crossed a river and went through the dangerous underground to redeem his people. Not too original, anyway, they were powerful and built the pyramids.

In the bible tells how the ancient Hebrews, the children of Jacob, ancestors of modern Jews, relocated to Egypt in a region called Goshen and thrived as sheep herders. Well new kings arose in Egypt and relations got soured with the Israelites, (the tribes who descended from the son's of Israel, (an alternate name for (Jacob). The Israelites were made slaves and had to build store cities and monuments. Moses lead them out of delivery in some great revolt.

It's told how they left in the night with dough for making bread on their backs and it baked in the desert sum without rising. That's the origin of Matza, or unleavened bread.

The Pharaoh sent his army and chariots after the escaping Israelites only to have disaster strike and they drowned in the Red sea.

The miraculous escape of an entire people from slavery to freedom is celebrated every year as the Festival of Passover. The Haggada consists of an arrangement of customs like eating butter herbs dipped in salt water or spilling wine for the Egyptians who died too, and then the entire family and relatives and guests have a holiday meal, akin to Thanksgiving in the USA or perhaps a Christmas dinner.

I read the version of the Haggadah that Rachel refers to and found it intellectually interesting but the only offense was to rework the original texts. It's totally innocent and P.C. and therefore banning it is like banning the story of Red Riding Hood as it might infer the wolves could eat grandmothers!

This is PC on steroids! I think the censor must have come from San Francisco and used the wrong herbs for their mint tea, LOL!

Asher
 

Rachel Foster

New member
I can understand finding it distasteful from a traditional perspective. What I CAN'T see is blocking the link. There is nothing pornographic or violent or anarchist anywhere in the darn thing.
 

Cem_Usakligil

Well-known member
Hi Rachel,

I am sorry but I don't understand your outrage. Face Book is a private organization which supplies free membership facilities under the condition that members comply with the TOS of Facebook. There are no guarantees anywhere that they will be universally objective and cater for the wishes of all members. They can be either fair or unfair, depending on whose perspective or political agenda it is. This applies BTW to any other "free" services such as gmail, blogger, etc. So if you don't like it, just don't use their services, it is as simple as that.

PS: Please pay attention to the fact that I am not saying that what they do is right, just that it is their prerogative to do so.

Cheers,
 

Rachel Foster

New member
Yes, I agree it is their prerogative. But such narrow-minded, authoritarian restriction of freedom should be challenged. And challenge I shall!







Oh, there's another windmill! Must tilt!
 

Rachel Foster

New member
I'm also well aware they may kick me off the service for my actions. I'm ok with that, recognize it as their right and in fact, support their right to do so. This is something I feel so strongly about I'd be wiling to spend a night or two in jail for it. Protests involve risks and consequences. I'm ready.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Rachel,

Every time a bird let's loose on us from up high, we can't divert our efforts to wondering why or to insisting their mother' toilet train them better. Just shower and say, "Next!"

Asher
 

Rachel Foster

New member
Thirty people joined my protest group. Did it make a difference? That depends on how you operationalize "difference." If you mean did it result in the unblocking of the link? No. Did it result in feeling as if we spoke out, made our feelings clear? The answer is yes. Sometimes the ultimate outcome is less important than the principle. Here, the principle was peaceful protest. It worked for me.
 
I think that it is valid to fight, or protest to have the WWW as free from censorship as possible. Google is doing it in China, no? At the end it is China's prerogative to sensor its citizens, but...

Someone took the effort to count how many deaths are there responsible for God on the Bible and how many on Lucifer's account.... it was like thousands against a few. What I am trying to say is that you cannot take this things seriously, they are just cultural collective poems and most of them make no sense. For example, take the story or Huitzilopochtli, a classical God of the Aztecs that "sprang from his mother's womb fully grown and fully armed. He then killed his sister.."

The story can be characterized as inventive, strange, etc. Offensive? mmm

People post religious stuff on my walls friends all the time. What do I do? I post materialist stuff too... it is fun, that is the nature of living in the free world. No Spanish Inquisition.



Huitzilopochtli's mother was Coatlicue, and his father was a ball of feathers (or, alternatively, Mixcoatl). His sister was Malinalxochitl, a beautiful sorceress, who was also his rival. His messenger or impersonator was Paynal.

In one of the recorded creation myths, Huitzilopochtli is one of the four sons of Ometeotl, he made the first fire from which a half sun was created by Quetzalcoatl.

The legend of Huitzilopochtli is recorded in the Mexicayotl Chronicle. His sister, Coyolxauhqui, tried to kill their mother because she became pregnant in a shameful way (by a ball of feathers). Her offspring, Huitzilopochtli, learned of this plan while still in the womb, and before it was put into action, sprang from his mother's womb fully grown and fully armed. He then killed his sister Coyolxauhqui and many of his 400 brothers. He tossed his sister's head into the sky, where it became the moon, so that his mother would be comforted in seeing her daughter in the sky every night. He threw his other brothers and sisters into the sky, where they became the stars.​
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
I think that it is valid to fight, or protest to have the WWW as free from censorship as possible. Google is doing it in China, no? At the end it is China's prerogative to sensor its citizens, but...

They cannot have a capitalist economy and yet keep the individuals suppressed for ever. As they educate people, they increase the number who know about Western freedoms. It's just a matter of time. However if they wish to be brutal enough, they can do as the Inquisition, that lasted 250 years! (The end of the Portuguese branch was in 1817 or thereabouts).

Someone took the effort to count how many deaths are there responsible for God on the Bible and how many on Lucifer's account.... it was like thousands against a few. What I am trying to say is that you cannot take this things seriously, they are just cultural collective poems and most of them make no sense. For example, take the story or Huitzilopochtli, a classical God of the Aztecs that "sprang from his mother's womb fully grown and fully armed. He then killed his sister.."

That's a pretty reasonable story. Its really the entire story of one with the good guys and bad guys made into one being born through one female and be done with it. Pretty neat.

Huitzilopochtli's mother was Coatlicue, and his father was a ball of feathers (or, alternatively, Mixcoatl). His sister was Malinalxochitl, a beautiful sorceress, who was also his rival. His messenger or impersonator was Paynal.

In one of the recorded creation myths, Huitzilopochtli is one of the four sons of Ometeotl, he made the first fire from which a half sun was created by Quetzalcoatl.

The legend of Huitzilopochtli is recorded in the Mexicayotl Chronicle. His sister, Coyolxauhqui, tried to kill their mother because she became pregnant in a shameful way (by a ball of feathers). Her offspring, Huitzilopochtli, learned of this plan while still in the womb, and before it was put into action, sprang from his mother's womb fully grown and fully armed. He then killed his sister Coyolxauhqui and many of his 400 brothers. He tossed his sister's head into the sky, where it became the moon, so that his mother would be comforted in seeing her daughter in the sky every night. He threw his other brothers and sisters into the sky, where they became the stars.​

Serves them all right! They should have realized he has the TV remote! He who has the remote decides the future!

Asher
 
I wondered what "Haggadah" is and found it is related to The Sedar, no?

I found a funny look at the tradition and posted it to facebook with no problems! I assume it is far more potentially offensive than yours... ah censorship.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
I wondered what "Haggadah" is and found it is related to The Sedar, no?

I found a funny look at the tradition and posted it to facebook with no problems! I assume it is far more potentially offensive than yours... ah censorship.
Haggadah is the story and Seder is the order of the story telling and customs. I thought that the link was very funny and apt. A Seder can last for 4 hours with everyone giving their explanations or can be fast tracked to take care of the children and get on with the meal.

Asher
 

Rachel Foster

New member
I found that, Edward, and thought it was delightfully amusing!

Our Seder went off beautifully and all were happy with the Haggadah. The only slip-up was when the last section mentioned "trans-gender" the woman reading it got a bit flustered. But it was a wonderful Passover celebration. I did have one complaint, though: One person had Dayenu running through her mind for hours. (And now I have the Dreidl song stuck in mine. "I had a little dreidl, I made it out of clay...")
 
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