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Tiny cameras and flash

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Chuck Bragg

New member
A month or so back I said the Canon SD700is was a fine camera (I had just received it). And so it is, but..... At least half and probably more of the flash pictures have circular marks on the image that look exactly like circular dried water drops. I figured it must be a faulty camera, but two other people on my trip also had the same problem with the same camera. From comments and googling the common wisdom is that the flash is reflecting off dust motes back into the lens, and this only happens because the flash is so close to the lens.

I am not a fan of flash photos, much preferring natural light, but still - I'd be interested to know what the real cause is, and whether other tiny cameras suffer from it. I am dubious - my wife's old Elph has never shown this problem.

BTW, my Egypt trip was terrific, we took about 1250 photos, most of them "travel snaps". Having the pocketable camera allowed me to take many more shots while at the same time enjoying the trip itself.
 
Asher Kelman

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Welcome back Chuck!

Glad you had a safe and enjoyable trip. We are all very much looking forward to seeing your pictures. While you were there, any chance you toook off to catch a view of the native wildlife, ie birds?

It could be that the images are repairable if you have sev eral images in a series and then one could end up with all the features. What percentage of shots were like this?

Asher
 
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Chuck Bragg

New member
So you're "all" looking forward to seeing my pictures? I had a higher estimation of this group than that.... No bird photos, I didn't take my gonzo equipment, just the Canon. I guessed right - there was not enough time to devote the necessary effort off-schedule. I'll look through them and put a couple up in Landscape/Tourism. I read the discussion about "spray and pray" vs. being a photograph-hunting lion, and on a trip like this you have very limited time to get any shot, and no chance to come back when the light's better. Definitely S&P time.

The percentage of flash problem shots is about 50. I've played with Photoshop, but the only remedy is the clone brush, and usually the background is not suitable.

Chuck
 
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Kathy Rappaport

pro member
Another Angeleno who travels...

Chuck,

Where was your trip that you took the little camera?

Your gear list is similar to mine. Every so often I think about taking my p&s (Canon S-80) and leaving the 5D home. I took the 5d to Europe last June to Spain, France, Portugal and England. When I got to England, I put it away and used only the S-80; I was so happy with some of my snaps (not RAW on that one) that I did think that just maybe I could do a whole trip like a tourist and not a photographer!

Thanks for posting that you did that. Maybe I will have to contemplate it Although the next trip is to Istanbul, Greece and Croatia and I doubt that I could do the Greek Islands with out my beloved 5D and a 24-70 and 70-200. Asher might tell me to just take the 50 1.2.
 
Asher Kelman

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Well Kathy,

The 70-200 2.8 L IS was a mistake to take to Europe as it's heavy! I used the 24-105 L IS most of the time. Now with the 50 1.2 L I'd just add the 21mm Distagon and the 70-200 f 4.0 which I'd upgrade to the IS lens. The 24-105 4.0 IS L is not used much and that's a pity since it's such a great lens.

Asher's
 
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Chuck Bragg

New member
Kathy, I was travelling in Egypt. The trip before was to London where I took my heavy equipment and my wife took her 3MB Elph. After two days my equipment stayed in the apartment and we used the Elph. If I had been shooting to make large prints, I would have continued with the 5D (Minolta), but this was a vacation, not a hunt for fine prints. Yes, I missed some shots that needed tender loving manual overrides and RAW flexibility, but not many.

The Egypt trip I knew would be more demanding on the camera, but I really did not want to miss any of the tourist aspect. I go on birdwatching trips and always see fewer birds because I hang back and photograph, and I'll always be this way with birds. But, a history and culture tour is different. You have to keep up with the group and you can't control the time of day, and you can't come back. The Canon was very highly rated as getting good shots on its automatic settings 99.9% of the time, and after a while I figured out how to trick it into the exposures I wanted in extreme situations. Plus, it fit in my breast pocket. I *always* had it with me. So, if your interest is in pictures first, take the heavy stuff. If your interest is first in the trip and second in pictures, go light - take a tiny P&S and a tiny sturdy pocket tripod to keep the ASA requirements down even in low light. And enjoy!

Now, is there anyone out there with an answer for those flash spots?

Chuck
 
S

Sean DeMerchant

Inactive
Chuck Bragg said:
A month or so back I said the Canon SD700is was a fine camera (I had just received it). And so it is, but..... At least half and probably more of the flash pictures have circular marks on the image that look exactly like circular dried water drops. I figured it must be a faulty camera, but two other people on my trip also had the same problem with the same camera. From comments and googling the common wisdom is that the flash is reflecting off dust motes back into the lens, and this only happens because the flash is so close to the lens.
Click to expand...


Correct. The dust motes are tiny, but with the fact that the inverse square of the distance from flash to subject to lens measures the power of the flash, one finds that tiny objects (dust motes) can reflect back an inordinate seeming amount of light. Add in that the dust motes are closer than your minimum focus distance and those bright points of light often become bright donuts of light for points closer than the focal plane which yields good boke and more DoF for points beyond the plane of focus which increases apparent DoF.

You should note that these halos only appear clearly against darker objects. They should show as reduced contrast on midtones. They should appear to be behind bright highlights.

I have some diagrams somewhere that may need some annotation if you are interested.

enjoy your day,

Sean
 
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Kathy Rappaport

pro member
Thanks for the travel suggestions. I might take just the 24-105 on the 5. My husband will take his 24-70 on his 20D. And if we're low on light, I will just have to borrow his gear. We'll have to see.

Wow - Egypt would be an amazing trip! Love to see the snapshots!
 
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Chuck Bragg

New member
Sean, I can understand the theory, but what I don't understand is why the SD700is has the problem and my wife's SD110 does not. They are both Canons and both have virtually identical distances from and angles to flash-to-lens numbers. The lens from the SD110 does not extend out as far as the SD700, FWIW.
 
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Ray West

New member
Hi Kathy,

If you want tele, and travel light, get the Kenko tele converters, both the 1.4x and the 2.0x teleplus pro 300. they will give better results then zooming in photoshop.

Best wishes,

Ray
 
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