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  • Welcome to the new site. Here's a thread about the update where you can post your feedback, ask questions or spot those nasty bugs!

Second Shot

Chris Calohan

Well-known member
Got my second shot this morning at 9:30 am CST (Moderna). So far, a bit of fatigue, a touch of nausea and my arm hurts like the dickens. Pretty much the same as the first shot...but the day /night is young so I'll let you know in the AM how I feel.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Got my second shot this morning at 9:30 am CST (Moderna). So far, a bit of fatigue, a touch of nausea and my arm hurts like the dickens. Pretty much the same as the first shot...but the day /night is young so I'll let you know in the AM how I feel.
Chris,

That’s simply great news! A lot of folk can’t get even the first shot. Now your chance of being in hospital is less than 1%!

Sorry you had a reaction. I had zero effects. I felt, like, did I actually get a shot!

My wife was complaining for several days!

Asher
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
The main concern about the COVID-19 vaccines has been among people with a severe allergic reaction to polyethylene glycol (PEG) or polysorbate, said Dr. Schmader. These ingredients are similar but not identical to components in the currently approved COVID-19 vaccines. The CDC recommends that people with this allergy not get the vaccine.

Similarly, the CDC recommends that people not receive the second dose if they had a severe allergic reaction following the first dose. The incidence of this occurring is low, said Dr. Schmader, about one in six per million doses. “If someone had an anaphylactic reaction, they should not get the second dose,” he said.

https://www.dukehealth.org/blog/weigh-benefits-of-covid-19-vaccine-against-risk-infection
 

Chris Calohan

Well-known member
Chris,

That’s simply great news! A lot of folk can’t get even the first shot. Now your chance of being in hospital is less than 1%!

Sorry you had a reaction. I had zero effects. I felt, like, did I actually get a shot!

My wife was complaining for several days!

Asher
Today is just a repeat of yesterday as per the sore arm, which still hurts like the dickens...but it hurt going in so I suspect she went in horizontally and not at a slightly downward angle which punts the needle into the grain and not across the grain of the muscle. Like cutting a fine piece of meat against the grain...you could have bought hamburger. :)
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Today is just a repeat of yesterday as per the sore arm, which still hurts like the dickens...but it hurt going in so I suspect she went in horizontally and not at a slightly downward angle which punts the needle into the grain and not across the grain of the muscle. Like cutting a fine piece of meat against the grain...you could have bought hamburger. :)
I have never seen this point discussed in medical literature but you have an interesting consideration and hypothesis there!

But it’s more complicated to explain systemic reactions such as headache, fatigue, which my come from the coveted manufacturers pet additives like metals and polymers added to magically stabilize the shot.

Believe it or not, they have even used breadcrumbs as adjuvant, LOL!

Asher
 

Chris Calohan

Well-known member
Cannot fathom the need for additives in a vaccine that requires refrigeration but I suppose there might be something to keep any little parts fluid throughout the vial...not that a little shake wouldn't do the same thing.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Cannot fathom the need for additives in a vaccine that requires refrigeration but I suppose there might be something to keep any little parts fluid throughout the vial...not that a little shake wouldn't do the same thing.
It just so happens that early vaccines were hard to be made effective enough for a large population. One person can be immunized, over time, with any crude or purified germ coat extract, such as a Unique proteins or polysaccharides of the microbe.

But, sadly, each individual shot can merely yield a tepid response. So it needs to be repeated until there are neutralizing antibodies. This approach could work for a thousand soldiers on a planned military expedition in an area of risk, but is not good enough for mass vaccinations.

Some of the additives are surprisingly cheap and simple and there only to “stabilize” the ultra-low concentration of the foreign antigen.

But “adjuvants”, that actually serve to BOOST immune response, can even require killing sharks for their livers to get a unique compound which has strong adjuvent properties turning a poorly antigenic suspension into a super-effective vaccine!

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Got my second shot this morning at 9:30 am CST (Moderna). So far, a bit of fatigue, a touch of nausea and my arm hurts like the dickens. Pretty much the same as the first shot...but the day /night is young so I'll let you know in the AM how I feel.
Chris,

I had my second shot this morning of the Covid-19 Moderna vaccine this morning, and it was asymptomatic, except that the lovely young eyes of the 29 year old nurse did make my heart litter a beat or two!

Now fatigue, nausea or anything like that in past ~5 hours since the shot!

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
If you were going to have any response, it would have been within the first 24 hours...no sore arm?
Nothing at all! I am hoping to get two more shots once there is enough for others.

With the slow rate of world vaccination, expect a need for at least one update a year as we are in for a good number of new variants and occasional one tgat has a new property that makes it more worrysome.

However, the mRNA technology of Pfizer and Moderna so editable, that update vaccines seems to be simple.

So these updates will be routine as it will be years before the world is vaccinated!

Asher
 

Alex Johnson

New member
It's great that someone has already been fully vaccinated. I’m still waiting for my turn, but I’ve already had COVID, I’m probably not even getting infected yet. Although I do not know, I also heard about cases of re-infection.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
It's great that someone has already been fully vaccinated. I’m still waiting for my turn, but I’ve already had COVID, I’m probably not even getting infected yet. Although I do not know, I also heard about cases of re-infection.
You only likely need one shot now. Get Moderna if you can as it is effective for the variants.

Best thing is that when you get your second dose, you will get such a great increased amount of antibodies that you are likely protected from serious illness with even newer variants!

Good luck,

Asher
 

nicolas claris

OPF Co-founder/Administrator
I received my first injection (Astrazenica) last Tuesday, so far so good! No symptoms, no harms : - )
2nd shot will be on May 25.
I had to negotiate with the Social Security administration as I do have the age to get vaccinated (upon French rules) but no comorbidity, I did argue that for my work I have to frequently travel to Italy and Spain… (with is absolutely true)
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
Why does one need a vaccination for something that has a 99.74% percent survival rate without any specialized treatment? Oh yes people can have long term effects from a myriad of illness.

No vaccine is 100% effective.

To know what proportion of a community would be immune after a vaccination program is a numbers game .
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Why does one need a vaccination for something that has a 99.74% percent survival rate without any specialized treatment? Oh yes people can have long term effects from a myriad of illness.

No vaccine is 100% effective.

To know what proportion of a community would be immune after a vaccination program is a numbers game .
If 500, 000 extra deaths in the USA doesn’t bother you (include one brother and one sister of mine), then you are living in a different value system than the rest of us!

The vaccines pretty well abolish need for hospitalization and lines of refrigeration trucks to store dead bodies, too many for burial or cremation.

Essentially, your comments lack community empathy for the worth of the lives lost prematurely.

Fine for you, but for the rest of us your comments are offensive and repetitively add nothing but flaming.

if you were dumb, merely a uninformed and uneducated Trump follower, I would ignore your comment. However you are highly educated and know better.

You know you have said it before. You know others find your view dismissive of the suffering and losses of others. So why repeat it? Where is that value, for you?

Asher
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
If 500, 000 extra deaths in the USA doesn’t bother you (include one brother and one sister of mine), then you are living in a different value system than the rest of us!

The vaccines pretty well abolish need for hospitalization and lines of refrigeration trucks to store dead bodies, too many for burial or cremation.

Essentially, your comments lack community empathy for the worth of the lives lost prematurely.

Fine for you, but for the rest of us your comments are offensive and repetitively add nothing but flaming.

if you were dumb, merely a uninformed and uneducated Trump follower, I would ignore your comment. However you are highly educated and know better.

You know you have said it before. You know others find your view dismissive of the suffering and losses of others. So why repeat it? Where is that value, for you?

Asher
My inquiries are valid questions Asher and it is ignorant of you to suggest that there are not. The point is are 500 thousand deaths going to be prevented in the future now that vaccinations are available? Vaccinations are also available for a number other viruses but not every one gets them either?

So again I will rephrase my question: Will the vaccines have a impact on transmission when you consider my above statement. I am suggesting that they will not unless you and the professionals can communicate things with some realism, things will stay the same.
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
The vaccines prevent illness, long term crippling and expensive morbidity, transmission and death! The fact that people can die later is a nonsense argument, as murder then would never be a crime!

Thr new vaccines developed will revolutionize the fight against all infectious disease and cancer and extend life of those otherwise vulnerable.

This time is one of the most amazingly significant advances in medical science of disease prevention and therapeutics in a century of miraculous inventions!
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
The vaccines prevent illness, long term crippling and expensive morbidity, transmission and death! The fact that people can die later is a nonsense argument, as murder then would never be a crime!

Thr new vaccines developed will revolutionize the fight against all infectious disease and cancer and extend life of those otherwise vulnerable.

This time is one of the most amazingly significant advances in medical science of disease prevention and therapeutics in a century of miraculous inventions!
How can it have enough impact on transmission to make a difference if not enough people get vaccinated? How do you stop the virus from circulating? Why is the process for getting the shots so primitive? This vaccine has been six decades in the making since RNA was first discovered in 1960 so inventions don't happen overnight and I don't believe in miracles or magical thinking. Stop trying to bribe me with some type of emotional blackmail. One thing this proves is that free market systems can solve problems and government is totally incompetent.

In Canada? Our Pfizer vaccine supply ran out last week. And, as of this writing, only about two per cent of Canadians have received a potentially life-saving jab.

https://torontosun.com/opinion/kins...nce-now-seen-by-all-thanks-to-vaccine-foibles


Nobody is more familiar with the impact of COVID-19 than staff at nursing homes and assisted living facilities that have been ground zero for the pandemic. Large numbers of residents and staff have contracted the virus. Nearly 40% of the COVID deaths in the US have occurred among residents of these facilities. Over 1,500 nursing home staff have also died from COVID, making nursing home caregiver the most dangerous job in America.

Nonetheless, many long-term care staff continue to refuse the COVID-19 vaccine. In a recent CDC report, nursing homes had a median vaccination rate of 37.5% for staff during the first month of the federal vaccination effort; by comparison, a median of 77.8% of nursing home residents received the vaccine. This has surprised some policymakers. Recently, Maryland’s acting health secretary told state lawmakers that about one-third to one-half of staff offered the vaccine chose to have it –– nowhere near an expectation of 80% to 90%. In a bit of positive news earlier this month, a large national nursing home chain reported 61% of staff and 84% of residents had been vaccinated as of early February, still far short of many policymakers’ expectations.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/why-wont-some-health-care-workers-get-vaccinated-2021021721967
 
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Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
How can it have enough impact on transmission to make a difference if not enough people get vaccinated? How do you stop the virus from circulating? Why is the process for getting the shots so primitive? This vaccine has been six decades in the making since RNA was first discovered in 1960 so inventions don't happen overnight and I don't believe in miracles or magical thinking. Stop trying to bribe me with some type of emotional blackmail. One thing this proves is that free market systems can solve problems and government is totally incompetent.

In Canada? Our Pfizer vaccine supply ran out last week. And, as of this writing, only about two per cent of Canadians have received a potentially life-saving jab.

https://torontosun.com/opinion/kins...nce-now-seen-by-all-thanks-to-vaccine-foibles


Nobody is more familiar with the impact of COVID-19 than staff at nursing homes and assisted living facilities that have been ground zero for the pandemic. Large numbers of residents and staff have contracted the virus. Nearly 40% of the COVID deaths in the US have occurred among residents of these facilities. Over 1,500 nursing home staff have also died from COVID, making nursing home caregiver the most dangerous job in America.

Nonetheless, many long-term care staff continue to refuse the COVID-19 vaccine. In a recent CDC report, nursing homes had a median vaccination rate of 37.5% for staff during the first month of the federal vaccination effort; by comparison, a median of 77.8% of nursing home residents received the vaccine. This has surprised some policymakers. Recently, Maryland’s acting health secretary told state lawmakers that about one-third to one-half of staff offered the vaccine chose to have it –– nowhere near an expectation of 80% to 90%. In a bit of positive news earlier this month, a large national nursing home chain reported 61% of staff and 84% of residents had been vaccinated as of early February, still far short of many policymakers’ expectations.

https://www.health.harvard.edu/blog/why-wont-some-health-care-workers-get-vaccinated-2021021721967
You can’t be on both side of the argument, first dismissing it then talking about is an issue!

These vaccines are the result of immense USA investment in Universities throughout the world, that is translated by industry, not the other way around!

Canada COULD have vaccinated almost everyone by now, just as I Israel, but most folk were like you, James, dismissing it all!

Your people pay for fashion, cigarettes, candies, iPhones and fancy electronics but not in vaccine strategic purchase and production!

Asher
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
You can’t be on both side of the argument, first dismissing it then talking about is an issue!

These vaccines are the result of immense USA investment in Universities throughout the world, that is translated by industry, not the other way around!

Canada COULD have vaccinated almost everyone by now, just as I Israel, but most folk were like you, James, dismissing it all!

Your people pay for fashion, cigarettes, candies, iPhones and fancy electronics but not in vaccine strategic purchase and production!

Asher
I never dismissed anything but you can deflect all you want simply to avoid the question that I have presented. Again inventions do not happen overnight that is a simple fact, the vaccination is a result of discoveries made 60 years ago. It is true that free market systems were quick on the draw but it wont stop the virus from circulating. Oh don't forget your Governor Cuomo who is now under investigation. How many deaths was he responsible for? Our Prime Minster is more interested in his own political career. You could get a well paying job selling used cars or maybe fridges to the Canadian Inuit people. The reality is a large majority are not interested in the vaccine based on the fact that they have a 99.74% survival rate without any specialized treatment. Yet you can't come up with any convincing argument as to why they should and at the same time fail to acknowledge the problem. I haven't witnessed any miracles ? Please do not take any of this personally.

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Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
You have not yet made a consistent coherent argument. Just go back and read what you have written here dismissively. Whatever percent you quote doesn’t matter, rather it’s those who are maimed for life or die that counts when hundreds of millions are infected!

Asher
 

Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
James,


a start of you lack of fact checking, no where is a figure of 99.74% survival rate documented by scholars.

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Obviously, documented mortality is NOT 0.26%! WHERE DID THAT AMAZINGLY IOTIMISTIC FIGURE COME FROM?

The death rate is over all about 1.3 to over 4%!

So you are still dismissive of the gravity of the pandemic as a slaughterer of the population!

Really no excuse, and you are so confident. I am the MD, Ph. Virologist and you think you can rewrite epidemiology for us!

At least I go to unimpeachable sources and done pretend I know it all!

Asher
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
James,


a start of you lack of fact checking, no where is a figure of 99.74% survival rate documented by scholars.
Obviously, documented mortality is NOT 0.26%! WHERE DID THAT AMAZINGLY IOTIMISTIC FIGURE COME FROM?

The death rate is over all about 1.3 to over 4%!

So you are still dismissive of the gravity of the pandemic as a slaughterer of the population!

Really no excuse, and you are so confident. I am the MD, Ph. Virologist and you think you can rewrite epidemiology for us!

At least I go to unimpeachable sources and done pretend I know it all!

Asher
Just a different set of numbers from different sources but regardless that won't change peoples minds and nor will the virus stop circulating. The reality is we don't know because we don't know how many people who have had it. We could get a new one next year and this one could vanish without a trace just like other viruses have in the past. What happed to Sars and why was it driven into extinction? One in five people died and now its gone. Had to have been a miracle.
 
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Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
Not true! You have no sources. The data I quoted are valued by academics and governments alike!

Coronavirus vaccines are the most brilliant fruit of the NIH investment of the USA government to Universities every where for the last 75 years!

This is the first rung of the ladder of new vaccines and virus prevention!
 

James Lemon

Well-known member
Not true! You have no sources. The data I quoted are valued by academics and governments alike!

Coronavirus vaccines are the most brilliant fruit of the NIH investment of the USA government to Universities every where for the last 75 years!

This is the first rung of the ladder of new vaccines and virus prevention!
So your plan is to convince people to get a vaccine based on those numbers? The average Joe and Mary public don't care about your numbers. How was the deadly virus Sar's driven into extinction without a vaccine? Where did swine flu go ?
 
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Asher Kelman

OPF Owner/Editor-in-Chief
So your plan is to convince people to get a vaccine based on those numbers? The average Joe and Mary public don't care about your numbers. How was the deadly virus Sar's driven into extinction without a vaccine?
I am not trying to convince folk of anything at all. The facts speak for themselves!
 
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